True Historic ´59 Bavarian Makeover

[El Gringo]

Great photos from the Shop, thank you so much for posting .

 

[Zoomer]

Here is the album from my 2012 visit to the Nashville Custom Shop. Lots of hand work.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/65524869@N05/albums/72157630077641830

Killer pics thanks

 

[hoss]

Thanks! If you go up to my album list you can see other albums from the trip. The Memphis Custom Shop was an even greater experience for me personally.

 

[RavenTooth]

Big Al's comments are interesting. I'm certainly not trying to win any sort of argument, I'd just like to know the truth. I'm not saying they didn't use machines to make the guitars in the 50s. I don't believe they were built with hand tools. I also wasn't saying there isn't anything handmade about modern custom shop guitars. My 2013 has evidence of that.

But, I do remember watching a video tour of the custom shop where a comment was made along the lines of "In the 50s it was easy to find skilled workers because a lot were coming from the furniture making industry. These days it's harder to find, so we rely more on CNC machines to do things like the top carve."

True Historics also boast things like a double carved neck, where the final carving is done by hand. This implies the whole neck is carved by automation on other Historics.

 

[Zoomer]

Thanks! If you go up to my album list you can see other albums from the trip. The Memphis Custom Shop was an even greater experience for me personally.

Love them all - is this a custom tour or can anyone go on one?

 

[hoss]

Love them all - is this a custom tour or can anyone go on one?

This was a big honor for me, organized by Thomann (largest music store in Europe) with the help of Gibson Germany.

 

[geddy402]

Here is the album from my 2012 visit to the Nashville Custom Shop. Lots of hand work.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/65524869@N05/albums/72157630077641830

I went on a tour of the custom shop about a year ago. Very impressed with the work they are doing. Agree there is still a lot of hand work being done. Maybe the biggest difference I see is that fret boards are preassembled outside of the custom shop and the tops are initially carved by CNC. Not sure how the initial cut of the top was done back in the day.

I think the biggest difference between now and the. would be production variability. The current shop keeps things much more consistent than the vintage counterparts, which someone can argue that the product being built now is better...from a production variability Lean Six Sigma standpoint...

ducking for cover...

 

[hoss]

The only problem I have with the current CS construction method - and this came to light early in this thread - is that they glue the fingerboard to the neck before the neck is set in the body.

23_Necks by BernardMartin, auf Flickr


These are the infamous 2012 dual layer boards, btw.

18_Fretboards by BernardMartin, auf Flickr

 

[sws1]

I think the biggest difference between now and the. would be production variability. The current shop keeps things much more consistent than the vintage counterparts, which someone can argue that the product being built now is better...from a production variability Lean Six Sigma standpoint...

ducking for cover...

It was done with a duplicarver which automatically traces one guitar and carves an equivalent. That machine is still at the Custom Shop. They use it for other guitars. Just not LP.

CNC is basically the same thing...automatically carving a piece of wood from a template. In this case, CNC uses data on a computer. Duplicarver uses another guitar as the source.

 

[Wilko]

It was done with a duplicarver which automatically traces one guitar and carves an equivalent. That machine is still at the Custom Shop. They use it for other guitars. Just not LP.

CNC is basically the same thing...automatically carving a piece of wood from a template. In this case, CNC uses data on a computer. Duplicarver uses another guitar as the source.

The word "automatically" does not apply to the orginal process. It was not automatic. Workers had to move the cutting head around and follow the template. On the duplicarver there was/is also play in the motion between the two that in today's world would have an unacceptable level of tolerance.

Same with necks. In the old days they were band saw cut rough boards, same as now, but the profile were shaped by workers "rolling" the blanks on big sanders and carvers. Today, that band saw cut blank is clamped into a CNC mill and comes out shaped like a neck.

 

[sws1]

The word "automatically" does not apply to the orginal process. It was not automatic. Workers had to move the cutting head around and follow the template. On the duplicarver there was/is also play in the motion between the two that in today's world would have an unacceptable level of tolerance.

Rudimentary and with wider tolerances, but hardly "hand carved".

 

[Wilko]

Rudimentary and with wider tolerances, but hardly "hand carved".

Right.

CNC makes for a much more consistent product as well.

 

[Zoomer]

The only problem I have with the current CS construction method - and this came to light early in this thread - is that they glue the fingerboard to the neck before the neck is set in the body

It was done the same way in the 50's sir

 

[geddy402]

It was done with a duplicarver which automatically traces one guitar and carves an equivalent. That machine is still at the Custom Shop. They use it for other guitars. Just not LP.

CNC is basically the same thing...automatically carving a piece of wood from a template. In this case, CNC uses data on a computer. Duplicarver uses another guitar as the source.

I think I remember seeing that now that you said what it is called. Thanks!

 

[J T]

So the end result is that this guitar is still a True Historic, or is it now a Replica?:hmm

 

[hoss]

So the end result is that this guitar is still a True Historic, or is it now a Replica?:hmm

Fact is, it's a non original True Historic. Whenever you need to sell something like it you will probably lose a lot of money no matter how great it is. For the used buyer it's a "boogered Gibson".

 

[J T]

Used buyers love to point out things to bring the price down.

 

[J.D.]

So the end result is that this guitar is still a True Historic, or is it now a Replica?:hmm

It will always be a True Historic IMO. Only now it is a TH with a (well documented) Bavarian Makeover.

 

[El Gringo]

Used buyers love to point out things to bring the price down.

Correct , it is no longer mint or stock as it has been altered .

 

[J T]

Fact is, it's a non original True Historic. Whenever you need to sell something like it you will probably lose a lot of money no matter how great it is. For the used buyer it's a "boogered Gibson".

OK I think I understand. It is not correct for a Gibson True Historic, pretty close but not quite a '59, not a replica, because it originally came from Gibson.