The ULTIMATE upgrade.

[1958teaburst]

So...the most important factor in your tone is, arguably, your wiring harness?
I have a very hard time believing this, especially when considering pickups, amp/speakers and the player.
On the other hand, I think it's really interesting to be wrong in the process of learning something new.
Does anybody have A/B recordings?

I suppose I should have clarified. When speaking about a Les Paul style guitar, player and amp setup not in the equation, the harness makes as much of a tonal difference as having a great set of pickups. I guess I’m used to reading about people going on and on about thumbwheels, top wrapping, old wood, soft brass saddles etc when they have cts pots and Emersons. Obviously if the player can’t play out of a wet cardboard box and they use a $50 practice amp, it won’t matter. But when you are an accomplished player who has a setup that is sensitive to what you are playing, I put these vintage components at the top of the list. I know many who would agree.

 

[charliechitlins]

I suppose I should have clarified. When speaking about a Les Paul style guitar, player and amp setup not in the equation, the harness makes as much of a tonal difference as having a great set of pickups. I guess I’m used to reading about people going on and on about thumbwheels, top wrapping, old wood, soft brass saddles etc when they have cts pots and Emersons. Obviously if the player can’t play out of a wet cardboard box and they use a $50 practice amp, it won’t matter. But when you are an accomplished player who has a setup that is sensitive to what you are playing, I put these vintage components at the top of the list. I know many who would agree.

That's cool.
I hate to be a d**k...I really do...but my over-educated, skeptical, 20th century, Bronx/Yonkers self says, Anybody making a claim like that is trying to sell me something.
But...If I could hear such a difference, I could certainly be a buyer.
My "burst" is a 71 LP Deluxe with a dead ringer for a '59 neck with a pair of Antiquities, so I'm pretty dedicated to "that" PAF tone.
I also have a '58 ES175 with original, unmolested PAF.
I'd love to hear some A/B, before/after recordings.

 

[charliechitlins]

Threadkiller?

 

[Jay T]

Most astute.

I have a hearing defect due to scaring from measles when I was 5.

Because of this (described as "cookie bite" hearing) I could always hear low and high frequencies the same as you, but because they were almost all I could hear I notice things most people don't. It's not that YOU don't hear them, but YOUR BRAIN filters them out.

Walking down the street I can tell you who has what electronics on.

You probably could hear it too, but your brain is wired to hear more frequencies so it does not dwell on what I hear or filters it out to save your sanity.

To most people I am nearly deaf. Vocals have been out of my register for so long, now that I have hearing aids which give me back those frequencies my brain does not process it correctly all the time.

So 70-75% deaf with aboot a 60% comprehension.

A lot of peeps think I am an idiot. (Some are sure of it!)

I choose to enjoy that which I can hear. Caps are one thing that make a difference to ME.

So: hearing IS quite different and can lead to a very interesting life, and VERY different perceptions.

That is extremely interesting ! It reminds me of the Movie Augest Rush ! Even though your hearing was damaged, you were also rewarded with a quality that none of us will ever experience. I recently had a laryngectomy, and they tell me that my hearing will diminish, test show that Im not picking up high pitches as well as I should, which has me guessing when adjusting pickup heighth, I know you should raise them to the higher side anyway.

 

[Jay T]

I just got a Les Paul yesterday that have 57's. They are advertised as open coil 57's. I really like them but I noticed that a lot of people don't seem to like them so much. One person commented that he had covered sets that he was never really satisfied with but he just played one uncovered and was pleased with the sound and is wondering if that could be making the difference in what he hears.So in attempting to achieve the vintage sound, if I were to start to build something and started with Tylers harness, what pickup options would you all recommend ? Seems like a lot of people like custombuckers, are there some others ?I have read the phrase "good wood years". Does that refer to tonal quality, and what years were best ?

 

[corpse]

Good wood years is crap. Something sellers on ebay came up with 15 years ago.
There is plenty of love for 57's but I think they are geared towards folks that prefer a hotter PUP. Someone put them in an '88 prehistoric I owned and they were great.
Spend some time with the guitar before you get too concerned about surgery- is there something actually missing, or are you just honestly going off of what you have read? Mess with the knobs some- start with the tone at 7 and the volume at 7.5 on both, and adjust from there. See what happens. And be sure the strings are new. Take some time before you start down the expensive and frequently unfulfilling worm hole of guitar improvement.

 

[EXPLRGAB]

I have read a great deal regarding the many and various pickup/wiring upgrades available....yeah I am a guitar nerd.... and obviously in good company here. I am a bit confused about the wiring spec of Gibson Custom Shop offerings beginning 2019.....Are these wiring harnesses not in the ballpark of spec, quality,
vibe, MOJO, bumblebees....ETC of the harnesses Teabust deals in.

 

[RossL]

I too have a 2019, end of year run R9. I was told the caps are correct paper in oil but the wiring harness, wire type and pots are not right.

 

[RossL]

Hey guys, Tyler here. I was notified that I don’t receive messages on here for some reason and I’m working on it. I recently took this in full time and will be making a website that you can directly order from. I’ll have it set up so you can put in the exact ohm readings, cap values, aged or nos(just for looks) etc. I recently nailed down my process for the stress fracture lines because finding nos covers is hard enough without even considering have those cool lines we all want. I’ve been on this forum almost since it’s inception and consider anyone on here like “Vintage Guitar Brethren” and with that said, I really pour every bit of my heart and soul into these. Sometimes I get a couple hours of sleep or pull all nighters. Because consistently is very important to me even though Centralab wasn’t in some ways. I test every completed pot for scratching, taper, value(obviously), and torque. I would also like to put this old rumor to rest about the 500k pots being closer to 550k. That is 100% not true because I (and I commissioned my girlfriend at the time ?) personally measured over 900 nos 500k elements and put them into different bins. When we were all done I would say that 65% were 450-500k, 20% were 500-550k, and the remaining 15% were either under 450k or over 550k. I’d say the chances are slim that I got some sort of anomaly with such a sample size. I also have the capabilities to rebuild old non functioning pots and bring them back to their former glory. Mods I do understand that I can’t post ads in the classified section unless I’m a sponsor. I’m sure the same goes for self promotion. Hopefully this post is ok as all it does is explain a little bit of what I do and my standards as a tone nerd. I’m going to work on this message problem but feel to email me as well with questions. Sunburst582@hotmail.com

Hi Tyler, I am interested in pots, caps, wiring harness and have not been able to reach you. Sent an email to your Hotmail but not sure if you received it.

 

[Jay T]

Good wood years is crap. Something sellers on ebay came up with 15 years ago.
There is plenty of love for 57's but I think they are geared towards folks that prefer a hotter PUP. Someone put them in an '88 prehistoric I owned and they were great.
Spend some time with the guitar before you get too concerned about surgery- is there something actually missing, or are you just honestly going off of what you have read? Mess with the knobs some- start with the tone at 7 and the volume at 7.5 on both, and adjust from there. See what happens. And be sure the strings are new. Take some time before you start down the expensive and frequently unfulfilling worm hole of guitar improvement.

Thank you for the reply and info. Im not going to make any modifications to my guitars, I was thinking of getting a body, husk from Stratosphere or somewhere and building one.I was thinking that it might be a more affordable way to go, in the sense that I wouldnt have to buy everything at once

 

[Jay T]

Thank you for the reply and info. Im not going to make any modifications to my guitars, I was thinking of getting a body, husk from Stratosphere or somewhere and building one.I was thinking that it might be a more affordable way to go, in the sense that I wouldnt have to buy everything at once

I did a google search on the wood and a lot of people said the same thing as you about it bs.

 

[Drayve85]

Most astute.

I have a hearing defect due to scaring from measles when I was 5.

I have heard that measles can be very scary! A lot more scarier than mumps, and chicken pox ain’t got nuthin on measles! ?

In all seriousness, I’m sorry that you lost some of your hearing, but glad you found a silver lining in it. I think it’s pretty interesting what you CAN hear, or what your brain has a chance to notice.

 

[TM1]

I bought a "ML R-9 Les Paul, Light Aged" back in July. I dropped in a set of Wizz pickups & I thought it was pretty great and then I put in a set of Tyler's Centralabs... Wholly crap..! It has the tonality of an old CMI-era Gibson! I got another set up for my `64 ES-335 and again it's clarity is amazing! I have a set of Pat.#'s from a `65 SG in the 335. To my ears, Tyler's Centralabs are worth every penny!

 

[CK6]

I bought a "ML R-9 Les Paul, Light Aged" back in July. I dropped in a set of Wizz pickups & I thought it was pretty great and then I put in a set of Tyler's Centralabs... Wholly crap..! It has the tonality of an old CMI-era Gibson! I got another set up for my `64 ES-335 and again it's clarity is amazing! I have a set of Pat.#'s from a `65 SG in the 335. To my ears, Tyler's Centralabs are worth every penny!

What did you have in there before (pots and caps)? What makes it sound so good? is it just brighter with a different taper? Or am I missing something here?

I have Throbak harnesses and I think they sound good with my vintage wire Mojo & Wizz pickups... What differences can I expect witn Tyler harnesses?

thanks

 

[CptZar]

Found him when looking for Centralab on Reverb. Perfect set for any conversion.

 

[p19978]

A very wise man once told me "If it sounds good... it is good".

 

[dlacx]

I had commented early in the thread. The '97 R8 in my profile has a set of Custom Duncan/Bonamassa '59's wound on the Leesona winding machines. It just wasn't sounding that good. I went ahead and put one of Tyler's harnesses, and HOLY COW! Did it ever improve this guitar. Much more responsive. Expensive, but I'm really happy with them. I did have some issues with communications that caused me some frustration, but Tyler did come through and did understand why I was frustrated, but, things happen in lives and communication goes a long way.

I really want to thank him for this set-up. I've been working with this guitar for awhile to get what I wanted. Now, I've got it.

 

[CK6]

Does anyone have comparison clips, or can anyone explain the difference between the sound of these harnesses compared to VIP, Creamtone or Throbak?

To everyone that has these Tyler harnesses - what did you have before? Stock Gibson pots?

Thanks.

 

[ajtonly1]

Does anyone have comparison clips, or can anyone explain the difference between the sound of these harnesses compared to VIP, Creamtone or Throbak?

To everyone that has these Tyler harnesses - what did you have before? Stock Gibson pots?

Thanks.

They all sound good but are different.........my 2 pennies
The CTS True Vintage tapers, which are found in the Throbak & Creamtone, are very good and it's hard to be unhappy with them
with that being said

the roll off is not as responsive as the VIpots
The VIpots are also stellar with a better rolloff in my opinion, but that's just my experience,

The Vipots are close but they seem to allow more bottom end than the Centralabs
while the Centralabs seem to allow more of that high-mid bark I was looking for.

The CTS & VIpots are damn close and you would not be dissappointed but lets be honest, we are all here looking for that last 1%

If you want that last %, be it amps pedals, pickups or pots, that's what you are paying for. I myself wanted it and couldn't be happier.

Different strokes for different folks, some people will say waste of money but will gladly spend the same amount on a pedal,
we all have our tone search...................
Good luck on yours

1. FYI Tyler is a great guy to deal with, I can't recommend him enough or say enough nice things about him
2. I've dealt with Throbak, and they are awesome people as well.
3. Ordered straight from VIpots, and customer service was stellar.
4. My daughter has a set of the Nostalgic, can't say anything yet as I have not tried them, but his customer service was also spot on.
5. 59 Parts on reverb from the EU, another good seller
6. CrazyParts in Germany, great people never dissappointed............
7. ************STAY AWAY FROM CREAMTONE!!!!!!! Do a quick search, his dealings have become dodgy at best and it's not worth risking your hard earned money, dealt with him back in the day, he was great, after covid, something happened, but it has not been once he once was.

 

[CK6]

They all sound good but are different.........my 2 pennies
The CTS True Vintage tapers, which are found in the Throbak & Creamtone, are very good and it's hard to be unhappy with them
with that being said

the roll off is not as responsive as the VIpots
The VIpots are also stellar with a better rolloff in my opinion, but that's just my experience,

The Vipots are close but they seem to allow more bottom end than the Centralabs
while the Centralabs seem to allow more of that high-mid bark I was looking for.

The CTS & VIpots are damn close and you would not be dissappointed but lets be honest, we are all here looking for that last 1%

If you want that last %, be it amps pedals, pickups or pots, that's what you are paying for. I myself wanted it and couldn't be happier.

Different strokes for different folks, some people will say waste of money but will gladly spend the same amount on a pedal,
we all have our tone search...................
Good luck on yours

1. FYI Tyler is a great guy to deal with, I can't recommend him enough or say enough nice things about him
2. I've dealt with Throbak, and they are awesome people as well.
3. Ordered straight from VIpots, and customer service was stellar.
4. My daughter has a set of the Nostalgic, can't say anything yet as I have not tried them, but his customer service was also spot on.
5. 59 Parts on reverb from the EU, another good seller
6. CrazyParts in Germany, great people never dissappointed............
7. ************STAY AWAY FROM CREAMTONE!!!!!!! Do a quick search, his dealings have become dodgy at best and it's not worth risking your hard earned money, dealt with him back in the day, he was great, after covid, something happened, but it has not been once he once was.

Thanks Alex for the detailed response! That is exactly what I was looking for. I agree, I have had great experiences with everyone that you mentioned but Creamtone, and would never order with them again.

Thanks again!