Luxe PIO bumblebee capacitors

GastonG · Feb 24, 2019

Good move in 2019 for Gibson Custom.

I installed these Luxe (paper-in-oil) capacitors in my Pearly ! Difference in the tone ? Oh yeah :note

Here's a little recording of "before and after" :

The first & third riff was done with the 2009 Gibson bumblebee capacitors, the one in the middle is with the Luxe capacitors.
http://dicitte.com/images/4LPforum_bumblebee_ggTest.mp3

My conclusion (my 2 cents...) is that the tone with the pre 2019 bumblebee sounds "wrapped" or kind of a trap-tone...
With the Luxe caps, I found that I get a more open-tone (a more vintage tone).

Gaston :salude

p.s. this test is not perfect science... but it's guitar player science... (as Elwood Francis once said)

Maxmc · Feb 24, 2019

I CAN hear the difference between 2 and 1 & 3. Very subtle, but it's there especially as the last note trails off. A tad more high end or "unboxed" sounding. It took a couple of listens though. Is this them?: https://luxe-radio.com/products/matched-pair-of-luxe-oil-filled-022mf-bumble-bee-capacitors-2

GastonG · Feb 24, 2019

Maxmc said:
I CAN hear the difference between 2 and 1 & 3. Very subtle, but it's there especially as the last note trails off. A tad more high end or "unboxed" sounding. It took a couple of listens though. Is this them?: https://luxe-radio.com/products/matched-pair-of-luxe-oil-filled-022mf-bumble-bee-capacitors-2

Yes ! and they are the same capacitors you will find in the 2019 Custom Shop Les Paul

I do found the Luxe tone "unboxed sounding" indeed.
:salude

surfreak · Feb 25, 2019

For my education, in the sound files are the tone pots fully open? if so, would that not effectively bypass the tone cap, or is there some tonal effect due to the PIO capacitor also when the tone pot is fully open?

GastonG · Feb 25, 2019

surfreak said:
For my education, in the sound files are the tone pots fully open? if so, would that not effectively bypass the tone cap, or is there some tonal effect due to the PIO capacitor also when the tone pot is fully open?

Yes on the first soundfile, the tone pot is fully open. I was also surprised with the result and very happy tone wise.

Here's another test done with the tone pot at 7 1/2 and the volume pot still at 10 : again first and third is the 2009 bumblebee and second riff is with the Luxe capacitors.
http://dicitte.com/images/4LPforum_bumblebee_ggTest2.mp3
on Audacity, the waves of that test2 looks like that:

Gaston :salude

Patek · Feb 26, 2019

Just to confirm the 2018 models have the old cheap ones - are these available to buy after market and the consensus is to install them to improve a 2018 model?

sws1 · Feb 26, 2019

surfreak said:
For my education, in the sound files are the tone pots fully open? if so, would that not effectively bypass the tone cap, or is there some tonal effect due to the PIO capacitor also when the tone pot is fully open?

Fully open is not the same as bypassing the pot. The pot is still adding minuscule levels of load into the circuit. That's why people created "no load" pots which really do cut the circuit when the pot is on 10.
Whether it's audible, or whether that's the source of the sound difference here, I don't know. But it's conceivable that the electrons are bouncing around a bit differently.

sws1 · Feb 26, 2019

GastonG said:
Yes on the first soundfile, the tone pot is fully open. I was also surprised with the result and very happy tone wise.

Here's another test done with the tone pot at 7 1/2 and the volume pot still at 10 : again first and third is the 2009 bumblebee and second riff is with the Luxe capacitors.
http://dicitte.com/images/4LPforum_bumblebee_ggTest2.mp3
on Audacity, the waves of that test2 looks like that:
View attachment 9148

Gaston :salude

Maybe you can put a frequency monitor on the same section of each lick, and then take a screen grab to see what the frequency graph looks like.

I certainly hear a diff.

1jamman · Feb 27, 2019

Patek said:
Just to confirm the 2018 models have the old cheap ones - are these available to buy after market and the consensus is to install them to improve a 2018 model?

Last time I looked (which was a while back now, Years now ) Yes , Luxe sold lots of different parts (vintage accurate) , directly to the public . Which includes their Caps .
I did purchase from them years ago , caps and some "other things" . Find their web-site , I don't have it , off hand , to link it to you here .
They are easy to deal with and do things right ...

Since tone is subjective (no on can really tell you what's best for you) .. And you're wanting to use PIO caps , theirs have been very good . Don't like them ?,,, swap them out for something else or back to what you already had ... It's fast and easy to do ...

Unless you look to purchase Vintage Caps , these are what I would buy.

sws1 · Feb 27, 2019

Patek said:
Just to confirm the 2018 models have the old cheap ones - are these available to buy after market and the consensus is to install them to improve a 2018 model?

https://luxe-radio.com/collections/all/bumblebee

Axelorox · Feb 28, 2019

Thanks for posting this. I've been contemplating changing the caps on my 2008 R7, which should have the same Gibson bumblebee caps that your 2009 guitar had. What made you go for the Luxe PIO, vs the other after-market vintage style caps?

GastonG · Feb 28, 2019

Axelorox said:
Thanks for posting this. I've been contemplating changing the caps on my 2008 R7, which should have the same Gibson bumblebee caps that your 2009 guitar had. What made you go for the Luxe PIO, vs the other after-market vintage style caps?

Luxe paper-in-oil capacitors are made with this machine and Donovan is absolutely dedicated to his work. Also the fact that the Custom Shop went to him for the 60th anniversary of the 59 Les Paul (for the bumblebee PIO capacitors).

:salude

El Gringo · Mar 1, 2019

Very impressive

zombiwoof · Mar 1, 2019

When Luxe started out he was just putting new Bee cosmetics on the outside of Russian PIO caps. I was wondering what he was going to do when the Russian supply of .022uf Russians got scarce (like it is now, they are getting harder to find in large quantities and more and more expensive, I know because I have been selling them on Ebay and elsewhere for some years). Now it seems he has gone to making his own caps, and I think that is a better proposition, I always thought just putting a pretty cover on a Russian PIO and charging 5X more for them was kind of phony and misleading, I applaud him for going all in and making his own caps now.
Al

fender69 · Mar 3, 2019

GastonG said:
Yes on the first soundfile, the tone pot is fully open. I was also surprised with the result and very happy tone wise.

Here's another test done with the tone pot at 7 1/2 and the volume pot still at 10 : again first and third is the 2009 bumblebee and second riff is with the Luxe capacitors.
http://dicitte.com/images/4LPforum_bumblebee_ggTest2.mp3
on Audacity, the waves of that test2 looks like that:
View attachment 9148

Gaston :salude

The difference is unmistakable!

folgers_is_evil · Mar 3, 2019

I recently did the same move by changing them in my 2007 R9. More open souding and when you roll off the volume, the circuit behave differently too I think. It was striking.

Cool that gibson put the real deal into their RI right now!

Axelorox · Mar 3, 2019

Another question for Gaston - did you consider changing the pots on your 2009 guitar?

GastonG · Mar 4, 2019

Axelorox said:
Another question for Gaston - did you consider changing the pots on your 2009 guitar?

Nope ! CTS Audio taper were among stock 2009 features ! (the shaft and thread are in solid brass like CTS's TVT audio taper potentiometers)
:salude

original pots in my Pearly vs newer CTS "TVT"

joafink2 · Jun 2, 2019

Just put some of these in my Les Paul with P90s. I had decent caps in before (mojotone vit t), but was curious if I'd notice a change between the two. The luxe definitely sound warmer and clearer to me which is exactly what I wanted. I'm pleasantly surprised by the difference and they made a great guitar even better. Well worth the money in my opinion.

Blackie59 · Jun 8, 2019

Kind of late to this thread but I'd like to know if the Luxe caps are going to be any different than the Sprague PIO caps I have in it already? Mine are .22 and .15.

Luxe PIO bumblebee capacitors

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