The NEW $20,000 Murphy Lab 1959 Limited Edition Brazilian Les Paul... what are your thoughts?

[modavis99]

I own one. Best Les Paul I’ve ever played. It’s clear they put a lot of time and effort into these. And I’ve owned a lot of historics over the years.

Overpriced? Sure. But I’m glad I have mine … and I will gig it next weekend.

Note the stock pickups sound amazing but they will squeal at higher gain so I put in different pickups

PS $16K is the going rate. Some said they have paid $14K but won’t say where.

 

[ourmaninthenorth]

20 bags to spare?

Gibson would be approx 634th on the list.

Lost interest with the smoke and mirror acrobatics of modern Gibson corp years ago.

Maybe it's me age....

 

[jb_abides]

Maybe it's me age....

OldManInTheNorth?

 

[ourmaninthenorth]

OldManInTheNorth?

I'm in the process of segueing from incompetence to incontinence.

 

[MattD1960]

As I mentioned in another thread about Gibson pricing.. they’re actively switching the brand to be a “luxury item” and thus pricing the average user out of this end of the market by charging unbelievable amounts for what is supposed to be a working tool. Giving the rise in guitar sales during the plague, Gibson are jumping on this (and their history) to cover all price points in the market and knowing their most expensive guitars are selling have decided to roll out this “you can’t afford this guitar but I can” marketing strategy, which is aimed at those with larger budgets. Which unfortunately alienates the vast majority of broke musicians who have the most desire for these models. I also believe part of the top end marketing strategy is to create future collectibles on par with the originals and thus perpetuate the market and longevity of the brand.
That said I feel Gibson management are aware of this and their core customers, hence the new Standard range being the best it’s ever been and in my opinion are the best “bang for buck” you can get.

this this this.
couldnt possibly agree with you more here Marc. Gibson is clearly following a path already laid in front of them, and its a carry over for me from something else i am passionate about. Watches. So many common areas with Hodinkee, and Watch marketing in general, and for the most part it will work cuz at the end of the day they are marketing a similar product. you dont NEED a gibson to play guitar you dont NEED a rolex to tell the time, its an object you WANT.

and let us also not forget this community for the last 25 years has been clamoring for exactly what this guitar is. on the spec sheet it is the most accurate recreation of a burst on record from gibson. go back to the early 2000s and you can dig up thread after thread about Braz boards, and truss rod condoms, and 57 classics and burst buckers. we have slapped gibson upside the head time and time again for not just giving us everything and now they have and people still are not happy. its expensive but all these guitars are. i have been on here almost 20 years when I was in high school the idea of owning 1 R9 was akin to me having a billion dollars, now i own a few and i am no billionaire, its all relative and obviously gibson has done the research and it shows that there is a market for 20,000$ burst recreation. I for one love the stuff they are doing, I cant afford it but its great to see the brand finally embrace the stuff we have been sqwaking about for the last 20 years

 

[MarcB]

agree with you more here Marc

I appreciate your response.. as I was commenting from the consumer perspective and evaluating the Gibson business model as a consumer.

Unfortunately with the rise in the rich becoming more rich.. the market for “luxury items” has risen significantly with already established brands shifting their focus on this area.

You’re correct with using luxury watch brands as an analogy, as I’ve been an avid fan of certain watch brands and seen their meteoric rise in prices, above inflation, since the early 2000s.

This has since effected/shifted my perception of the brands (Omega & Rolex) and as such have stopped wearing my Omega Speedy (Snoopy) as I don’t like the social connotations it now has.. (and because it’s now worth considerably more than what I paid in 2004!!?) which is why I’m now happy wear a Hamilton khaki (lol).. because as you rightly pointed out .. it keeps time as well as the “luxury watches”.
So that said .. and in agreement again with what you said.. this pushes the consumer to question and reason “why do I need a Gibson to play guitar”.

We’ve all seen many newer brands becoming very successful due to their consistency, construction and more importantly, the price point.
The established brands are trading on their brand loyalty and the desire for the consumer to reach the top level of their product range but unfortunately this again prices the average musician out of the market and invites the collector in.

 

[AA00475Bassman]

Im still trying to figure out how Gibson over the years like since 94 the guitars they sold me Historic guitars totally incorrect ? Now I'm being advised by Gibson I need a set of &1000.00 pickups & a $ 15000. R9 ?

 

[ADP]

Gibson has been a "luxury brand" since day 1. They have understood the concept for their entirety. A good book that lays out the processes of luxury companies is Trading Up: by Michael J Silverstein and Neil Fiske

 

[MarcB]

Gibson was primarily an incredible “top end” instrument maker from day 1, bought and used by musicians as a working tool. The instruments were never classed as “luxury items”.

 

[jb_abides]

Yes, are we really going to talk about Day One when a restaurant clerk became a sole proprietor?

 

[ForeverFabFour]

I'll admit I didn't read the OP because it seems quite excessive & lengthy; after all I am 63 years old and I could prolly die before I read the entire post?

However I did see something about a NEW guitar costing $20,000 so, that doesn't require me reading the entire post and offering my opinion to say NOPE on blowing that kinda ca$h on a new fiddle ...... you're welcome

Yeah, sorry... I have a hard time speaking my mind without doing into detail. I live for the discussion. I guess you didn't need to read everything to get the gist. Title was enough like you said.

Anyways, hope you're still with us!

 

[ForeverFabFour]

Neither did I but we all get the gist of it.

Pricing for these doesn't bother me. Braz quantities are limited, many people buy these only to preserve/flip, Gibson should charge whatever they want. Also, nobody needs a new aged Les Paul with a Braz board. If you want it, pay for it, if you can't afford it or squawk at the sticker price, find something else. I would like to drive a Lamborghini or Ferrari, I would never pay that much for four wheels, but I still appreciate them from afar, don't complain how much they cost, and carry on with my Toyota, no different than Braz Murphys.

I wouldn't say the pricing bothers me as much as I the struggle to understand any sort of marketing or reasoning from Gibson. I'm not saying it makes sense, but when Bugatti sells you a $2,795,000 Chiron, they don't talk about how great it is a daily driver. They hardly even mention the fact that it's a car!.
And that's part of the issue for me. Gibson are marketing this as one of their best playing and built 59 replicas they've ever done. So if they're marketing it as a tool to be used, I don't understand the pricing. I wish they would've leaned into it more as a way for those obsessed with Tom Murphy to get their kicks or as the ultimate flex for the millionaire collector.

And not to turn this into a car chat, but I actually do understand why Rolls-Royce and other manufacturers charge as much as they do.
The difference is auto manufacturers, like Bentley, Bugatti, Rolls-Royce, Ferrari and others are actually selling you a product that you can't really get anywhere else. Toyota doesn't make a hybridized, mid engine, twin turbo V8 producing over 1000hp combined, with all the carbon fiber like Ferrari does with the SF90 Stradale. And as I said before they aren't leaning into the narrative that it's just a car. They are marketing it as an exclusive must have product for the super wealthy. If Gibson is going to charge these insane prices, they're going to have to start doing this type of marketing more, but they will run the risk of alienating the majority of their player base who wants the best burst they can get, but only has a couple grand.

 

[ForeverFabFour]

The Brazilian fetish is silly.
There are a lot of pre-'66 Gibson's with Brazilian fretboard for a lot less than 20k.
I own several.

I couldn't agree more! I have two different Epiphone Casinos (62 & 65) that have Brazilian boards that were made along side the 335s and 330s. Cost less than $5k each when I picked them up in the last few years.

 

[ForeverFabFour]

lm curious, you said that the two guitars you tried were among the best custom shop guitars you have ever played. Taking the price out of it, did you like them better than the standard Murphy Lab Les Paul? Did you think they “better “? Thanks

I played them alongside a standard Murphy lab Les Paul, and only noticed a slight difference. I think these two guitars were particularly resonant, but I don't think that's anything to do with this specific model. Cosmetics aside they didn't play better than a standard Murphy lab. The neck profiles just felt a little more rounded than usual which was nice, at least compared to recent "standard" 1959 reissues from the Murphy lab. And as I stated above the pick ups felt a little more open, quacky, closer to a real PAF.

So do I stand behind the fact that they were two of the best custom shop Les Pauls I've ever played, yes, but I don't think they were leagues ahead of anything else. It was very much splitting hairs. And that's a lot of extra dough for a 1% or 2% perceived gain in quality.

 

[AA00475Bassman]

My thoughts are I'm hanging on to my $ 20000.00 , Rumor I'm hearing if these sell well Gibson plans on a signature Brazilian Clown Burst .

 

[These go to 11]

Im still trying to figure out how Gibson over the years like since 94 the guitars they sold me Historic guitars totally incorrect ? Now I'm being advised by Gibson I need a set of &1000.00 pickups & a $ 15000. R9 ? View attachment 24529

Same! I thought the 2019 was a Clone" to the 59? that is what Gibson made claim in the advert for them? So they added a Braz board to these and tacked on another $10K?
what am i missing here? From the Gibson ad,
"Gibson Custom Shop's 60th Anniversary 1959 Les Paul Standard is not just a tribute to the priceless original models -- it's a clone of them. From laser-scanned dimensions to chemically-recreated plastics to color-matched shades of sunburst, every element has been rendered in unbelievable detail. It represents the culmination of yearly advancements to accuracy and authenticity since Gibson Custom Shop began examining vintage Les Pauls over twenty years ago.
I guess "CLONE" means something different to the folks at Gibson? To me it means copied down to the very minute details!

 

[bursty]

I wouldn't say the pricing bothers me as much as I the struggle to understand any sort of marketing or reasoning from Gibson. I'm not saying it makes sense, but when Bugatti sells you a $2,795,000 Chiron, they don't talk about how great it is a daily driver. They hardly even mention the fact that it's a car!.
And that's part of the issue for me. Gibson are marketing this as one of their best playing and built 59 replicas they've ever done. So if they're marketing it as a tool to be used, I don't understand the pricing. I wish they would've leaned into it more as a way for those obsessed with Tom Murphy to get their kicks or as the ultimate flex for the millionaire collector.

And not to turn this into a car chat, but I actually do understand why Rolls-Royce and other manufacturers charge as much as they do.
The difference is auto manufacturers, like Bentley, Bugatti, Rolls-Royce, Ferrari and others are actually selling you a product that you can't really get anywhere else. Toyota doesn't make a hybridized, mid engine, twin turbo V8 producing over 1000hp combined, with all the carbon fiber like Ferrari does with the SF90 Stradale. And as I said before they aren't leaning into the narrative that it's just a car. They are marketing it as an exclusive must have product for the super wealthy. If Gibson is going to charge these insane prices, they're going to have to start doing this type of marketing more, but they will run the risk of alienating the majority of their player base who wants the best burst they can get, but only has a couple grand.

If, and I state if, I were ready to throw down $20K on a Braz board LP style guitar I would seriously be talking to multiple private builders that have (1) the reputation for producing excellent builds (2) are willing to produce buyer references (3) are able to make a guitar according to your build spec (4) have a reasonable wait time (5) will agree to a signed contract

Those builders are out there and you could obtain a guitar specified to your build requirement and still have a chunk of change left over compared to a $20K guitar that isn't custom made to order specifically for you.

Something to consider for those folks with $20K to toss around for a mass produced instrument .......

 

[Wizard1183]

Same! I thought the 2019 was a Clone" to the 59? that is what Gibson made claim in the advert for them? So they added a Braz board to these and tacked on another $10K?
what am i missing here? From the Gibson ad,
"Gibson Custom Shop's 60th Anniversary 1959 Les Paul Standard is not just a tribute to the priceless original models -- it's a clone of them. From laser-scanned dimensions to chemically-recreated plastics to color-matched shades of sunburst, every element has been rendered in unbelievable detail. It represents the culmination of yearly advancements to accuracy and authenticity since Gibson Custom Shop began examining vintage Les Pauls over twenty years ago.
I guess "CLONE" means something different to the folks at Gibson? To me it means copied down to the very minute details!

That’ll never happen. Because if they did that? Ppl will still complain it’s not right. lol not to mention you’ll pay through the nose for it

 

[These go to 11]

That’ll never happen. Because if they did that? Ppl will still complain it’s not right. lol not to mention you’ll pay through the nose for it

I agree and fortunately there are some talented builders out there that will build you one for less money. I was told Bartlett does a very accurate build?
Not sure if he even does replica's anymore though?

 

[These go to 11]

I played them alongside a standard Murphy lab Les Paul, and only noticed a slight difference. I think these two guitars were particularly resonant, but I don't think that's anything to do with this specific model. Cosmetics aside they didn't play better than a standard Murphy lab. The neck profiles just felt a little more rounded than usual which was nice, at least compared to recent "standard" 1959 reissues from the Murphy lab. And as I stated above the pick ups felt a little more open, quacky, closer to a real PAF.

So do I stand behind the fact that they were two of the best custom shop Les Pauls I've ever played, yes, but I don't think they were leagues ahead of anything else. It was very much splitting hairs. And that's a lot of extra dough for a 1% or 2% perceived gain in quality.

Thank you for this! It is always good to hear stuff like this from someone with hands on experience. TBH i am not shocked at your findings.
I prefer Braz if at gunpoint but not for another $10K! My pockets are not that deep.