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Jimmy Page no.1 '59 'burst

sozo

New member
Joined
May 20, 2022
Messages
16
Hi guys, you may have already seen the picture below of Jimmy Page's no.1 '59 Les Paul (I didn't take it, found it online). I find several aspects of it quite fascinating (being a guitar geek!). It looks like it's from the last decade or so, given the almost complete absence of red dye.

First, the tailpiece has been significantly raised on the bass side. My guess is this was either because JP preferred the string tension feel this way, and/or because, with it lower and not top-wrapped, some strings were snagging on the back of the bridge as they leave the saddles and travel to the tailpiece.

Second, a second set of thumbwheels have been added, the lower set screwed down tight to the maple top. I know some players like to do this to give extra support to the ABR1 posts.

The neck pickup appears to be screwed down quite low, slightly below the mounting ring. My guess would be this balances the output with the bridge pickup. Which, unless it's been changed again, isn't the original PAF, but from an early '70s Gibson, and is a T-Top. My understanding is that the original PAF failed on tour around '72-'73, and after a repair that only worked for a while, JP had it replaced with a T-Top from a new Gibson. Funny to think that, at least for the bridge pickup sounds, for the live recordings from the '73 tour we aren't hearing a late '50s PAF, but a bog standard '70s pickup. Which proves it's all in the fingers, not so much the gear used!

Interesting to see that there is absolutely no bleed through of red dye onto the binding - but of course the red dye has almost completely gone from the top too, as it often did on exposure to UV light over the years/decades. Maybe there was bleed through of red into the binding back in the day before the exposure to sunglight faded away so much of the red dye.

The mahogany back appears to be brown rather than having the red hue that many R9s have, but again, it may have been red originally but has now faded?

I guess Murphy Labs would call this one 'heavy aged', but of course in this case it's all genuine natural aging, from decades of use. Nothing artificial about this Les Paul or its owner!

Interesting to see the height of the volume/tone knobs above the top and the pointers.

I can't imagine Mr Page ever wanting to part company with this LP, but if it ever did go for auction my guess is the price would easily exceed $10 million USD, given it's provenance, and all those amazing Zeppelin tours and albums.

Also interesting to compare the first photo, I guess from maybe 2010+, with the picture below it of the same guitar taken I think in the early '80s, back when it still had a red sunburst look. Also, unless it's been changed, the switch cap appears white rather than amber.


IMG_E0934.JPG





jplp80s.jpg
 

jb_abides

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
5,452
First photo was from the Play It Loud exhibition at the Met, 2019.

Bridge: Seymour Duncan replaced the T-Top in the '90s.

Neck: 60s PAF replaced original PAF in the '00s.

Push/pull pot in rear volume that reverses phase was confirmed. Who knows he may have added more or wired differently at time of photo for the Met exhibition...? Because Pagey is cagey.

Lots of videos from the Met show. Here's but one:
 

jimmi

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2012
Messages
2,078
i disagree with some of the pickup comments. early TTops can be fantastic pickups. Different than PAFs? Sure but I like a good one in the neck position and with a swapped in long vintage magnet, they are sometimes great in the bridge position. So while I agree there is a lot in the fingers, some great sound to be had with a good TTop (and quality vintage pots which differ from the lower frequency cutoff 70s pots which flavor the sound of TTops).

I also like to stack the thumb wheels on mine. I think it helps transfer the strings to the body.
 

S. Weiger

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 25, 2002
Messages
1,773
'
i disagree with some of the pickup comments. early TTops can be fantastic pickups. Different than PAFs? Sure but I like a good one in the neck position and with a swapped in long vintage magnet, they are sometimes great in the bridge position. So while I agree there is a lot in the fingers, some great sound to be had with a good TTop (and quality vintage pots which differ from the lower frequency cutoff 70s pots which flavor the sound of TTops).

I also like to stack the thumb wheels on mine. I think it helps transfer the strings to the body.
Exactly, #metoo. And it also keeps the poor ol' bridge from wanting to kiss the bridge p.u. cover.. THAT's an experience one really could be without :eek:
 

Bryansamui

Active member
Joined
Jul 1, 2022
Messages
201
Hi guys, you may have already seen the picture below of Jimmy Page's no.1 '59 Les Paul (I didn't take it, found it online). I find several aspects of it quite fascinating (being a guitar geek!). It looks like it's from the last decade or so, given the almost complete absence of red dye.

First, the tailpiece has been significantly raised on the bass side. My guess is this was either because JP preferred the string tension feel this way, and/or because, with it lower and not top-wrapped, some strings were snagging on the back of the bridge as they leave the saddles and travel to the tailpiece.

Second, a second set of thumbwheels have been added, the lower set screwed down tight to the maple top. I know some players like to do this to give extra support to the ABR1 posts.

The neck pickup appears to be screwed down quite low, slightly below the mounting ring. My guess would be this balances the output with the bridge pickup. Which, unless it's been changed again, isn't the original PAF, but from an early '70s Gibson, and is a T-Top. My understanding is that the original PAF failed on tour around '72-'73, and after a repair that only worked for a while, JP had it replaced with a T-Top from a new Gibson. Funny to think that, at least for the bridge pickup sounds, for the live recordings from the '73 tour we aren't hearing a late '50s PAF, but a bog standard '70s pickup. Which proves it's all in the fingers, not so much the gear used!

Interesting to see that there is absolutely no bleed through of red dye onto the binding - but of course the red dye has almost completely gone from the top too, as it often did on exposure to UV light over the years/decades. Maybe there was bleed through of red into the binding back in the day before the exposure to sunglight faded away so much of the red dye.

The mahogany back appears to be brown rather than having the red hue that many R9s have, but again, it may have been red originally but has now faded?

I guess Murphy Labs would call this one 'heavy aged', but of course in this case it's all genuine natural aging, from decades of use. Nothing artificial about this Les Paul or its owner!

Interesting to see the height of the volume/tone knobs above the top and the pointers.

I can't imagine Mr Page ever wanting to part company with this LP, but if it ever did go for auction my guess is the price would easily exceed $10 million USD, given it's provenance, and all those amazing Zeppelin tours and albums.

Also interesting to compare the first photo, I guess from maybe 2010+, with the picture below it of the same guitar taken I think in the early '80s, back when it still had a red sunburst look. Also, unless it's been changed, the switch cap appears white rather than amber.


View attachment 24525





View attachment 24526
Jimmy's Bridge PAF starting Failing in late Feb on the Australian/New Zealand tour .
It was rewound by Merv Cargill in Melbourne.According to Merv, Jimmy was happy with the work.Im unsure what transpired from there but Jimmy had a T Top put in there shortly after which is first seen 27 May in Amsterdam ..
I was fortunate to know Jimmy's Road Manager/ tech at the time (Clive Coulson)
Jimmy's Neck PAF was quite unusual btw.
A current boutique PAF replica from say Fralin, Lollar, or Stephens designs won't get you in the ballpark.
 

janalex

Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2003
Messages
780
Jimmy's Bridge PAF starting Failing in late Feb on the Australian/New Zealand tour .
It was rewound by Merv Cargill in Melbourne.According to Merv, Jimmy was happy with the work.Im unsure what transpired from there but Jimmy had a T Top put in there shortly after which is first seen 27 May in Amsterdam ..
I was fortunate to know Jimmy's Road Manager/ tech at the time (Clive Coulson)
Jimmy's Neck PAF was quite unusual btw.
A current boutique PAF replica from say Fralin, Lollar, or Stephens designs won't get you in the ballpark.
Can you elaborate?
 

Bryansamui

Active member
Joined
Jul 1, 2022
Messages
201
I was just curious about the neck pickup specs
I only can be confident on the DCR.According to Clive Coulson who had the instrument in his hands daily, it was in the mid 8s. There is much sonic evidence to my ears it could have been an A2 magnet, but that's a quess .
I alter my vintage magnets to create that tone.My blueprint is the live No Quarter Solo from TSRTS.( A direct "A" original vs "B" replica comparison is on my YT channel last vid) It's real close.
As a sidenote, Clive Coulson was Jimmy's right hand man until 1972. Clive was a New Zealander and a customer of my shop when I was a Gibson Custom Shop in Auckland New Zealand.
He told me a fair bit about Jimmys Guitar.
Clive also was influential in Jimmy changing from Hiwatts to Marshalls.
 

Classicplayer

Member
Joined
Feb 6, 2002
Messages
230
I think I remember reading that Page's #1 Les Paul's original neck pickup was an extremeley bright sounding pickup; far brighter than what would be typically found on today's Les Pauls. Any indication of it's specific winding measurments offered up in these Page threads?

Classicplayer
 

Bryansamui

Active member
Joined
Jul 1, 2022
Messages
201
I think I remember reading that Page's #1 Les Paul's original neck pickup bright sounding pickup; far brighter than what would be typically found on today's Les Pauls. Any indication of it's specific winding measurments offered up in these Page threads?

Classicplayer
Best I can give you from my source is mid 8's( 8.5k+/-)..And there weren't digital meters/readouts I in 1972..That said , a few hundred ohms here or there won't change the tone.
My pickups can measure 8.1k in winter, the same pickup measuring 8.6k in warmer weather. That's why i put +/- 5% on em.....It's much more about about the Magnet with the Page Neck.
Ive wasted half my life away on that.

I think I remember reading that Page's #1 Les Paul's original neck pickup was an extremeley bright sounding pickup; far brighter than what would be typically found on today's Les Pauls. Any indication of it's specific winding measurments offered up in these Page threads?

Classicplayer
 

jimmi

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2012
Messages
2,078
Best I can give you from my source is mid 8's( 8.5k+/-)..And there weren't digital meters/readouts I in 1972..That said , a few hundred ohms here or there won't change the tone.
My pickups can measure 8.1k in winter, the same pickup measuring 8.6k in warmer weather. That's why i put +/- 5% on em.....It's much more about about the Magnet with the Page Neck.
Ive wasted half my life away on that.
Magnets can color the sound a lot. My favorite neck pickup I was surprised to find out has a ver very strong A5 magnet. For kicks I tried an A2…total garbage in comparison.
 

janalex

Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2003
Messages
780
Logic has always been that a high wind pickup is more mid heavy therefore an A5 would balance it with a mid scoop and an A2 would muddy it up
 

Bryansamui

Active member
Joined
Jul 1, 2022
Messages
201
Logic has always been that a high wind pickup is more mid heavy therefore an A5 would balance it with a mid scoop and an A2 would muddy it up
Vintage A2s and Vintage A5s are a lot closer sonically to each other than modern A2s vs modern A5s..
Most modern magnets I don't like, most A2s being rather closed in and dark sounding, while A5s have problems at both ends, the Bass being wooly or bloated and the treble being an ' ice pick'
 
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S. Weiger

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 25, 2002
Messages
1,773
Best I can give you from my source is mid 8's( 8.5k+/-)..And there weren't digital meters/readouts I in 1972..That said , a few hundred ohms here or there won't change the tone.
My pickups can measure 8.1k in winter, the same pickup measuring 8.6k in warmer weather. That's why i put +/- 5% on em.....It's much more about about the Magnet with the Page Neck.
Ive wasted half my life away on that.
Wasted? :unsure:
You must be putting us on.. But thanks for all your insight knowledge, it's very interesting! (y)
 
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