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Widespread misconceptions about great classic amps.

Hiwatts-n-Gibsons

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2024
Messages
777
I'll start.

Hiwatts have great cleans as pedal platform amps, but don't crunch up like an old Marshall.

Utter hogwash.

I have a DR103 and a DR504, both 100 watters. While it's true they have some of the most gorgeous, deep, clear, and 3 dimensional clean tones of any amp at ridiculously high volumes all you have to do is bridge the inputs with a jumper, and turn up the Normal and Brilliant volumes and even at lower Master Volume settings they start to crunch up gloriously with a bold punch and vicious midrange grind. Turn both those volumes up to around 3/4 or more and then crank up the Master volume, and you will have one of the most beastly and pissed off British crunch tones you ever heard from any amp. It will give any JMP or Plexi a run for it's money in grind, and at the same time punch even harder below the belt.

The other side of that coin.

Marshalls are great overdriven, but cannot compare to Fender cleans.

Again, poppycock. Marshalls have absolutely gorgeous cleans on tap if you know how to balance the Normal/Brilliant volumes and Master, and then use your guitar volume to go from clean to scream. If you need proof, then listen to Hendrix's or Zeppelin's live recordings.
 

ourmaninthenorth

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
7,210
The major misconception that I have with every amp is simply that I instinctively know how to use them.

I don't.

I have however over the years acquired the confidence to trust my ears; it's not been an easily learned skill, hampered by an ego that thinks it knows what's who.

I ask more than I expound.
 

c_wester

Well-known member
Joined
May 9, 2002
Messages
2,237
Wash that Hog.

Another thing is .... takes pedals so well??
What good sounding amplifier cannot have its sound modified better or worse with a pedal?
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
5,001
My biggest issue with all amps is my reluctance to turn them up and let the amps’ inherent tone come through. They live and breath at about 50% power. I never put them much above 2 or so.
Why not? Wife and (yes) pets. That level is just so loud. I never gig at that volume ( I have three amps- two 1960 Brown Fenders and a Marshall Silver anniversary).
Heavy sigh.
 

ourmaninthenorth

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
7,210
My biggest issue with all amps is my reluctance to turn them up and let the amps’ inherent tone come through. They live and breath at about 50% power. I never put them much above 2 or so.
Why not? Wife and (yes) pets. That level is just so loud. I never gig at that volume ( I have three amps- two 1960 Brown Fenders and a Marshall Silver anniversary).
Heavy sigh.
Therein lies the rub.

I'm using an Audio Kitchen Big Trees 1 watter, and a Matchless 9 watter - turned up both are a danger to shipping in a domestic sense.

Like buying a really powerful motor to tootle around town at 10mph.
 

renderit

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 19, 2009
Messages
11,036
My biggest issue with all amps is my reluctance to turn them up and let the amps’ inherent tone come through. They live and breath at about 50% power. I never put them much above 2 or so.
Why not? Wife and (yes) pets. That level is just so loud. I never gig at that volume ( I have three amps- two 1960 Brown Fenders and a Marshall Silver anniversary).
Heavy sigh.
But when you look at the way and "why" they were engineered this is right and proper.

Tube amps were built so you got pure tones WITH NO DISTORTION at certain levels.

Your major stereo manufacturers of the time (Macintosh, Fisher, Marrantz, Bang and Olufson) were powered WAY over what you should actually use so you had it cleaner louder.

Then the guitar players discovered they liked the sounds when they turned them up PAST the distortion point.

Not really designed for that.

But it is what it is...
 

J T

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 20, 2005
Messages
10,564
Great amp it'll rip your face off at volume. Air moving powerhouse. Woah. Stand back. It'll do ya.
Yes it also does great clean.

rHxLsDt.jpg


Another great amp awesome dirt channel. But also superb clean:

L2MyrAJ.jpg
 

Hiwatts-n-Gibsons

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2024
Messages
777
Great amp it'll rip your face off at volume. Air moving powerhouse. Woah. Stand back. It'll do ya.
Yes it also does great clean.

rHxLsDt.jpg


Another great amp awesome dirt channel. But also superb clean:

L2MyrAJ.jpg
The fact that Doug makes amazing amps is no misconception.
 
  • Like
Reactions: J T

Deus91

Active member
Joined
Apr 28, 2019
Messages
107
I'll start.

Hiwatts have great cleans as pedal platform amps, but don't crunch up like an old Marshall.

Utter hogwash.

I have a DR103 and a DR504, both 100 watters. While it's true they have some of the most gorgeous, deep, clear, and 3 dimensional clean tones of any amp at ridiculously high volumes all you have to do is bridge the inputs with a jumper, and turn up the Normal and Brilliant volumes and even at lower Master Volume settings they start to crunch up gloriously with a bold punch and vicious midrange grind. Turn both those volumes up to around 3/4 or more and then crank up the Master volume, and you will have one of the most beastly and pissed off British crunch tones you ever heard from any amp. It will give any JMP or Plexi a run for it's money in grind, and at the same time punch even harder below the belt.

The other side of that coin.

Marshalls are great overdriven, but cannot compare to Fender cleans.

Again, poppycock. Marshalls have absolutely gorgeous cleans on tap if you know how to balance the Normal/Brilliant volumes and Master, and then use your guitar volume to go from clean to scream. If you need proof, then listen to Hendrix's or Zeppelin's live recordings.
Absolutely!!!!! my '64 JTM45 Replica does Gorgeous cleans but I do also have a real Radiospares OT
and only use GEC KT66s. :cool:
temp-Imageqw9aw-L.avif
temp-Imagesha-Ez4.avif
 
Last edited:

Any Name You Wish

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 15, 2021
Messages
583
Oh I don't know if there are that many people with misconceptions these days with all the info out there on gear. Things get debunked pretty quick. We are all more aware of hearing damage so volume levels have come down and overdrive pedal sales have gone up. The part about amps sounding better at say 7 rather than 2, well it depends. In a small room it may actually sound better on 2 pointed right at your head. In a big hall, theatre, or outdoors for sure it will sound better on 7 pointed at your butt. I use my '59 Bassman RI at home on 2.5 and playing out on 4-7. There's no wasted power at any volume. That right there is the big misconception.
 

Hiwatts-n-Gibsons

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2024
Messages
777
Oh I don't know if there are that many people with misconceptions these days with all the info out there on gear. Things get debunked pretty quick. We are all more aware of hearing damage so volume levels have come down and overdrive pedal sales have gone up. The part about amps sounding better at say 7 rather than 2, well it depends. In a small room it may actually sound better on 2 pointed right at your head. In a big hall, theatre, or outdoors for sure it will sound better on 7 pointed at your butt. I use my '59 Bassman RI at home on 2.5 and playing out on 4-7. There's no wasted power at any volume. That right there is the big misconception.

I still routinely see posters saying that Hiwatts are harsh and brittle at low volumes, and even cranked don't break up much.

Having owned two DR103's and a DR504, all of them 100 watt models, nothing could be farther from the truth. Even at low volumes with Dynasonic type pickups I find it near impossible to get any tone I would consider harsh and brittle at any volume, and with the inputs bridged and turned up it gives up an awesome British crunch tone at even moderately low volumes. The only way I've been able to make them sound harsh is to plug into just the Brilliant input, turn the Bass way down, and then crank the Treble and Presence.
 

mikeslub

Administrator
Joined
Jul 15, 2001
Messages
15,308
Lately, I've been playing and gigging with two Fender Princeton Reverbs - a 1964 and 1967 - and they sound glorious clean. Stereo setup, with one hooked up to the gain/distortion/fuzz pedals and the other one hooked up to delays, chorus, etc. Great sound. Still loud but more manageable than bigger/higher power amps, and easier on my back when I have to shlep them around....
 

Wilko

All Access/Backstage Pass
Joined
Mar 11, 2002
Messages
21,011
I've played Hiwatts. It's not a misconception to recognize their relatively low gain and lack of really aggressive tones. Unless you are pete townshend at Leeds, they just don't do it for anyone but a stadium rocker.

The biacrown era upped the gain similar to the Jimmy Page Hiwatt to a very usable level
 

Hiwatts-n-Gibsons

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2024
Messages
777
I've played Hiwatts. It's not a misconception to recognize their relatively low gain and lack of really aggressive tones. Unless you are pete townshend at Leeds, they just don't do it for anyone but a stadium rocker.

The biacrown era upped the gain similar to the Jimmy Page Hiwatt to a very usable level
Cool. I own two, had a third for a while, and for a vintage styled single channel amp with an early master volume control circuit they hit Plexi/JMP gain levels with no problem.

As for the volume, while yes they get crazy loud, a really good attenuator takes care of that issue. I may not rock stadiums, but no other amp I have played sounds as incredible and consistent at everything from reasonable to insane volumes. Turn both input volumes to between 3/4 and max then turn up the Master to taste and the amp yields an amazing classic rock crunch tone which only gets better as the Master goes past halfway up.
 
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