Which do you think are the most important tonal qualities of a good Les Paul?

[Wizard1183]

You don't have to know that. You just need a desire to change it because you think it needs a change. Try something until you find what you are happy with. If you are happy why change it?
Thus changing the lax stock Strat whammy bridge. As an example.
I might change out the pickup in my 76 LP. Why? Because they are very low gain and I want more. So I have a SD Distortion. Ace did the same with his guitar. He didn't change it just for giggles.
Changing it because I want something different. Eddie was unhappy how single coils sounded so he changed them.

Exactly. changed it because wanted to. To be comfortable. Had nothing to do with tone. Thank you for reiterating that.

 

[Wizard1183]

Actually Alex Lifeson talks of a Lester he bought in the 70’s that was a funky guitar with a crap neck haha

And used it until 1980. If you’re an actual player? You grab a guitar and play it. Don’t like it? Change it to something else. They make everything now. No need to experiment.

Case in point: guys buys real PAFs for his reissue Lester. Disappointed cause he’s not tonally there 🤣🤣🤣

 

[Jethro Rocker]

Exactly. changed it because wanted to. To be comfortable. Had nothing to do with tone. Thank you for reiterating that.

Um, I did say change because I wanted something different, a change in the gain ie tone of my pickup. You can't read just part of a post.
No comment on changjng the bridge hey. And why he did. And Ace's Dimarzio. Etc.
Man....

 

[Lush_diviner]

"
GP: So why are you building your own guitars now?

EVH: See, actually I ruined a lot of old guitars. I just didn't like the fact of having the standard rock-star setup - you know, a brand-new Les Paul and a Marshall. I was really into vibrato. Like when we used to play the high schoool dances and shit, I bought myself a '58 Strat. But it's only guitar and bass and drums musically, and the rest of the guys just looked at me and said, "Hey, that thing sounds like hell!" [Laughs.] You know, single-coil pickups, they sound real buzzy, thin. It wasn't enough sound to fill it up. So the reason I started dickin' around that way is I wanted a Gibson-type of sound, but with a Strat vibrato. So I stuck a humbucking pickup in a Strat, and it worked okay, but it didn't get good enough tone because Fenders are kind of cheap wood - they're made out of alder or something. So then I found out about Charvel, but I'm suing them right now because it's actually my guitar design that's keeping them in business. See, Wayne Charvel sold it to another guy, and Wayne was a real cool dude. When he owned it, I was considering endorsing it. And then this other dude took over, and he's just sold so many of them for like a grand apiece. "

The other dude turned out to be Grover Jackson who made some pretty ok guitars.

 

[Wizard1183]

Um, I did say change because I wanted something different, a change in the gain ie tone of my pickup. You can't read just part of a post.
No comment on changjng the bridge hey. And why he did. And Ace's Dimarzio. Etc.
Man....

EVH changed the bridge almost a done times. He didn’t give a shit that one was better than the other? It was cause of legal shit. As long as it had a vibrato bridge. He kept Floyd rose for awhile but that was after they were huge

 

[Jethro Rocker]

EVH changed the bridge almost a done times. He didn’t give a shit that one was better than the other? It was cause of legal shit. As long as it had a vibrato bridge. He kept Floyd rose for awhile but that was after they were huge

He changed out the stock for a reason and kept the FR series.
Anyhow, people change pickups because they want something else.
Why? Because they prefer something different or aren't happy with what they have.
Kinda diverging from Op.
I'm out.

 

[Wizard1183]

He changed out the stock for a reason and kept the FR series.
Anyhow, people change pickups because they want something else.
Why? Because they prefer something different or aren't happy with what they have.
Kinda diverging from Op.
I'm out.

He never changed the stock cause it was body blank. It had nothing on it to begin with. I’ll agree with rest of what you said. To make your own fine. But it’s unneeded. A Strat routed with a hum bucket and an old Marshall jmp or superlead (whatever he used back then) youd have eddys tone.

Fact of the matter is, if you have a Les paul (any reissue if they played a Les paul) and same yr make model amp someone played and if they had a pedal or whatever? You’d have 80% of the tone. Doesn’t have to be the exact yr make model guitar. A guy posted himself with a 78 custom playing zeppelin and the tone was there. He had the right amp. Whether or not he used pedals? Idk? Marshall and reverb

My point is tonal qualities of the guitar are a bit overblown. But ppl are welcome to do whatever they wish.

 

[Wilko]

WTF are you so hung up on EVH. Everything I posted is true for the whole guitar industry. The 70s were an awful time for Gibson and Fender and because of the change in quality, MOST players were not happy with what was offered so they went to third parties, or swapped out for older/hotter pickups.

Yes it matters how old you are. If you weren't there, you likely don't know WTF you're talking about. Crack a book wise guy. Even Gruhn's guide to vintage guitars spells it out.

 

[Wizard1183]

WTF are you so hung up on EVH. Everything I posted is true for the whole guitar industry. The 70s were an awful time for Gibson and Fender and because of the change in quality, MOST players were not happy with what was offered so they went to third parties, or swapped out for older/hotter pickups.

Yes it matters how old you are. If you weren't there, you likely don't know WTF you're talking about. Crack a book wise guy. Even Gruhn's guide to vintage guitars spells it out.

I’m not hung up on evh. The guitars from fender and Gibson changed. Just as with any product that changes hands or a decade of a company. Gruhn’s guide? Yea ok if I’m going to compare 70s to 58-60? I can see the difference. Perhaps hear the difference acoustically. But can you HEAR the difference if one of the greats played a Norlin vs an original burst through a cranked Marshall?

I doubt it

 

[Wilko]

that's not the point. The point is that difference was felt in the stores and the guitars. It fueled the desire for the older guitars and launched the aftermarket stuff.

You just don't get it. The guitars changed, and not for positive reasons. It was mostly money saving changes that made the guitars not as good as previous instruments from the same companies.

Are you saying that didn't happen?

 

[Wizard1183]

that's not the point. The point is that difference was felt in the stores and the guitars. It fueled the desire for the older guitars and launched the aftermarket stuff.

You just don't get it. The guitars changed, and not for positive reasons. It was mostly money saving changes that made the guitars not as good as previous instruments from the same companies.

Are you saying that didn't happen?

Of course it happened. Just as every company in every industry changed for the worst.

But let’s not get ahead of ourselves here. If Bursts were so great? Gibson would’ve never stopped making them. It took Clapton, Green, Kossoff, Page etc to revive them. And then? It wasn’t til what? The 90s before they began recreating it?

And Gibson didn’t go cheap with its latest models. But they still don’t replicate the warmth/vibe of the old. So what’s the excuse now? There’s guys out there that have recreated bursts using vintage wood etc. Do those guitars have the IT factor? Idk? I’ve never played one…

To answer the OPs question? Who are you trying to replicate in tone? Everyone will have their own version of what they think is the he best tonal quality yet you might not like it? Just grab a guitar you enjoy that’s comfortable for you and play.

 

[RossL]

And used it until 1980. If you’re an actual player? You grab a guitar and play it. Don’t like it? Change it to something else. They make everything now. No need to experiment.

Case in point: guys buys real PAFs for his reissue Lester. Disappointed cause he’s not tonally there 🤣🤣🤣

I was under the impression he got rid of that guitar after he had the neck in a press a couple of times. But I agree with your as I’ve suffered through some dogs over the years hahaha 🤣

 

[Wizard1183]

I was under the impression he got rid of that guitar after he had the neck in a press a couple of times. But I agree with your as I’ve suffered through some dogs over the years hahaha 🤣

Article stated he used a 74 Les Paul into the 70s not exactly sure at what yr he replaced it? I’m assuming around 1980 cause he got it in 76. But that and the ES-335 were his guitars in the 70s

 

[charliechitlins]

I wouldn't say that a fat neck is a guarantee of great tone (because it isn't), but every guitar I've ever played that has made me stop and say "YEAH!" has had a chunky neck, be it a 'burst or my '55 Kay student model that looks like a Stratotone.
I only played my '71 Deluxe to be polite to the seller before telling him No (clowny, poorly routed, mini toggle, Schallers...)but the neck is a dead ringer for my 2 '58s (225 and 175), and it sounds incredible.
I still can't put it down.

 

[charliechitlins]

Oh...and...aside from the player, which is the most important...the next most important part of a Las Paul isn't even part of the guitar.
The amp.
All resonance, sustain, bark, spank, and towns like buttah are meaningless without the right amp.

 

[Wizard1183]

I wouldn't say that a fat neck is a guarantee of great tone (because it isn't), but every guitar I've ever played that has made me stop and say "YEAH!" has had a chunky neck, be it a 'burst or my '55 Kay student model that looks like a Stratotone.
I only played my '71 Deluxe to be polite to the seller before telling him No (clowny, poorly routed, mini toggle, Schallers...)but the neck is a dead ringer for my 2 '58s (225 and 175), and it sounds incredible.
I still can't put it down.

I had an 08 R9 I bought from Vic Dapra back when he was at guitar gallery in PA. Had a fat neck. Back then? I played a lot of distortion and the burstbucker 2s it had in it sound like shit. Too muddy. Perhaps pups could’ve been adjusted etc to clear it up? But traded it in for same price I bought it for TH59 with avg neck thickness. I enjoy it. I do kinda like a fatter neck? But my 74LPC has a thin neck and I enjoy it. It’s not my go to? But it’s still great. I still sound like me. Just different sounding between the two.

 

[Wizard1183]

Oh...and...aside from the player, which is the most important...the next most important part of a Las Paul isn't even part of the guitar.
The amp.
All resonance, sustain, bark, spank, and towns like buttah are meaningless without the right amp.

Exactly. The amp is perhaps the largest part of tone. Very difficult to achieve a certain tone without the same type of amp.

 

[Any Name You Wish]

Oh...and...aside from the player, which is the most important...the next most important part of a Las Paul isn't even part of the guitar.
The amp.
All resonance, sustain, bark, spank, and towns like buttah are meaningless without the right amp.

Agree. I've played my R9 through a lot of different amps recently, and I use an Origin Effects Revivaldrive with my Bassman, and there is a huge tonal landscape out there. Huge. You would not be able to tell it is the same guitar, or sometimes even if it is a Les Paul. However, I think the spirit of the OP's question was to judge by the unplugged tone and then the plugged-in tone using a great tube amp clean channel. Just an assumption, I could be completely wrong.

 

[axeman565758]

I have found, through owning Historics from almost every year of production, that weight makes no difference in tone. I won't buy one over 8 lbs 6 oz, simply because my 62 y/o shoulders dislike anything heavier.
What I have found does make a difference: electronics. Clearly a difference in tone between the various p'ups...Classic 57's, BB 1, 2, 3's or CustomBuckers. Pot and cap upgrades open up those p'ups.
I think the player (style) himself is the major difference. I've heard tone turds played by someone else and it sounded amazing. I've purchased Historics that the seller said he didnt like the tone at all and I loved it.

 

[1allspub]

I’ll call BS until proof is shown

You’ve been given proof over and over again, you just refuse to accept it.

EVH: “...the rest of the guys just looked at me and said, "Hey, that thing sounds like hell!" [Laughs.] You know, single-coil pickups, they sound real buzzy, thin. It wasn't enough sound to fill it up.”

That is exactly an example of being dissatisfied with tone.

You seem to think it’s one or the other but not possible to be both (ie, that changes are made because people are both dissatisfied with some things AND they want to make it their own). It’s not an either or thing.

You’re just flat wrong.