OK time to re-string. 2 questions for LP experts

[Kyle Ashley]

I played my last Les Paul live in 1980. Had a 47 year career in music doing it all. touring guitarist, studio work, producer etc. All of it was mostly done on Strats and Teles.

But I've loved Les Pauls since day one. Gave up a promising piano career after seeing Zep and falling for Page and that guitar. So the LP is ground zero for me. I still have my black '78 Custom, but a couple years ago I bought a Murphy Lab R9 in faded cherry burst, and a regular CS R9 in faded tea.

I'm recording them a bit these days and want to re-string and clean them up a bit. So my questions are:

Is there some insider trick to keeping the thumbwheels in place when removing the bridge? I want to be able to get them back to the exact spot as the guitars are both setup beautifully right now. I know how easy it is to spin them around a bit when wiping down the tops etc. I have a luthier ruler. Should I just measure it, or is there a better hack?

And...what is the most common string gauge for these guitars? I know Jimmy was a 9-42 man I guess. I think I have .10 sets on both LPs at the moment. If I go to 9s, how much neck adjustment should I prepare for?

I know on my Strats/Teles it ain't much work. They take anything with very minimal neck change.

 

[buckledknuckle]

I use a small piece of painter's tape on the thumb wheels. I'm very gentle with it as it will move if one isn't careful.

As far as string gauge... I have 4 LPs. I have one that plays best with 11s, two play best with 10s, and one with 9s. I play what the guitar likes, not what I think I like.

 

[corpse]

I change one string at a time vs full nudity. It helps keep things in place I think. I pull a rag under the TP and bridge.
.010-.046 for decades.

 

[poor man's burst]

If there is enough space under the thumwheels, you can add a second one under and tighten both together.

 

[JASIII]

I just measure the height from the bottom of each thumbwheel to the top of the guitar and re-set it after I restring.

 

[gary buff]

If it's set up perfectly don't remove the bridge, just clean around/under it. Also, if it's set up perfectly, it's easy to play for you and you like the tone stay with the strings that are on there. If it feels stiff with the current strings raise the tailpiece a smidge. Change one string at time and the wheels won't move. Also make sure the strings aren't hitting the back of the bridge when tuned to pitch, if so raise the tp until they clear.

If you do go to a different string gauge check the relief (bow) in the neck. You want a tiny bit of bow in there so the strings don't buzz (Page used 9s and the strings were laying right on the frets, you can hear them rattle on his power A chords on Celebration Day on the TSRTS album). Press down at the first fret and the fret where neck joins the body, in the middle between those two frets you should be able to slide a business card under the string cleanly. I forgot what the target measurement is, maybe someone can chime in, use an automotive feeler gauge. If you need more relief loosen the truss rod a quarter-turn, retune and check; less relief tighten it the same way. DON'T over-tighten it, sometimes people crank it so much it snaps and then you are Screwed with a capital S.

Probably TMI here, I'm not a pro but I've been setting up my own guitars for 52 years and I did some stupid things at first that I wouldn't want anybody else to do.

 

[GlassSnuff]

Cleaning your guitar should not involve such violent motions that the thumbwheels are disturbed. Maybe clean it more often?

 

[tmgcustom]

Measure it before and after you restring. The top of the 12th fret to the bottom of the string. Also check the
neck relief, especially if you change string brands. Not all strings have the same tension, even sometimes
the same brand can change the relief a tad. So, measure before, write it down, measure after, and make them
the same. Then finally double check the intonation, as that can slightly change too sometimes.

 

[Offshore Angler]

Dude, just change the strings. If you’re an old Strat player you already know to change them one at a time to keep the bridge correct. It’s adjustable. Just adjust it.

 

[tmgcustom]

​

And of course, there's always this..

 

[Kyle Ashley]

OK thanks for the tips. I will most likely do the measurement method. I could lightly wipe around the wheels, but I know how easy it is to bump and spin them and just a little makes a difference.

I'm good with setting neck relief etc, so if I change gauge I will monitor that. I use a string on my Lesters called The Perfect 10s from American String Co.
.10 - .12.5 - 16.5 - 26 - 36 - 46

I mostly do my Strats one string at a time, but every few months I will strip it for cleaning. I am solid on tech-ing Fenders, but don't have a bag of Gibson tricks.

I will probably do one string at a time for the ML, but I want to strip the regular R9 and buff off the entire top.

 

[Offshore Angler]

Well, I'm scratching my head about a 47 year touring guitarist and session player who doesn't know how change strings and their effects on truss rod adjustments, but whatever. You're obsessing over a problem that just doesn't exist. Just change the darned strings. As you must surely know, the Stratocaster has a longer scale length and higher string tension than a Les Paul, so it's not uncommon for us "touring and session guitarists" to have one gauge heavier on our Lesters than out Fenders to keep the feel consistent. The only time you really need to worry about the bridge on a Gibson is on an archtop with a floating bridge. In that case we mark the position with tape to keep the intonation. A lot of us will actually adjust the Les Paul thumbwheels onstage.

You may want to consider top-wrapping too. When you adjust your bridge the main thing to look out for is that the break angle isn't too steep and causing the strings to contact the back edge of the bridge. That will cause problems. A lot of newbs have this weird internet myth belief that the break angle over the saddles needs to be max'ed out and set the tailpiece too low. A lot of us who play for a job like to actually keep it lower by top-wrapping as it really helps tuning stability and feel and virtually eliminates string breakage. When Lester strings break it's almost always at the bridge. Too steep a break angle causes the strings to sufficiently kink over the saddle that their strength is reduced. You can usually crank the tailpiece lower on an ABR1 than a Nashville bridge, but in either case you will overdo it if you don't top wrap and crank the tailpiece down too far.

In any case, if you strip the R9 the traditionally-mounted bridge studs will need to be removed from the body and then it will need a complete setup when you're done anyway so why stress over it? Your R9 has an ABR1 bridge and those will collapse over time, and the studs will pick up a lean, so you really need to learn to deal with it. Modern R9's are beautiful guitars, but as road warriors - you need to keep up with the maintenance.

Chuck

 

[Offshore Angler]

Here, I'll make this very easy for you:

1) Change the strings and stretch them in
2) Tune to pitch
3) Check relief and adjust the truss rod as required
4) Set action height with the thumbwheels, if the break angle is too much raise the tailpiece accordingly (or just deck it and top wrap with double balls.)

That's it. You could have been done with this job yesterday.

As regular maintenance on an R9, always check your saddle radius and mounting studs during string changes. Replace as required.

 

[c_wester]

Jimmy Played 008 with a 14 on the g-string as I have understood after alot of digging.
Just take a caliper or tape measure and measure the thumbwheels from the top.

 

[charliechitlins]

I have several guitars where stuff just falls off everywhere if I take all the strings off.
I cut 5 off and leave one on to hold everything together.
My latest LP epiphany...I wind the 3 low strings UP on the post.
Less break angle at the nut and rock solid tuning.

 

[Offshore Angler]

I have several guitars where stuff just falls off everywhere if I take all the strings off.
I cut 5 off and leave one on to hold everything together.
My latest LP epiphany...I wind the 3 low strings UP on the post.
Less break angle at the nut and rock solid tuning.

Wow, that's a strange one. My gut is the nut is incorrectly cut and the slots are not sloping away at the correct angle. They should be cut with a downward slope from the neck to the peghead. Never hurts to angle the G towards the post too. Those danged pesky Gibson G strings. Something we all have to live with unless we can score an Aldo Nova. Then to make it worse, Gibson fixes it on the Platypus and the Explorer - the two most ergonomically egregious guitars they build.

So, there's a reason you don't want to string with the wraps upward to reduce the break angle, It can (and usually does) result in "sitaring" and it's the reason the headstock is angled in the first place. Combined with no angle on the nut it's almost guaranteed.

 

[charliechitlins]

Wow, that's a strange one. My gut is the nut is incorrectly cut and the slots are not sloping away at the correct angle. They should be cut with a downward slope from the neck to the peghead. Never hurts to angle the G towards the post too. Those danged pesky Gibson G strings. Something we all have to live with unless we can score an Aldo Nova. Then to make it worse, Gibson fixes it on the Platypus and the Explorer - the two most ergonomically egregious guitars they build.

So, there's a reason you don't want to string with the wraps upward to reduce the break angle, It can (and usually does) result in "sitaring" and it's the reason the headstock is angled in the first place. Combined with no angle on the nut it's almost guaranteed.

There's still plenty of angle and no sitaring.
You could try it.
My nut slots are always meticulously cut and angled, but winding up gives a little extra insurance and, I feel, a looser/more compliant feel.
Especially the E string windings can bind when pulled tightly down in the nut.
And this Gibson G string thing.
I've been gigging Gibsons g for over 40 years and have not experienced it, but I was lucky to have an excellent luthier explain some stuff to me very early on.
On Fenders, I leave a lot of string and wind it right down; this negates the need for string trees on at least 5, sometimes all 6 strings.
It takes longer for a fresh set to break in, but I can feel a difference in compliance

 

[Kyle Ashley]

Chuck - I didn't say I didn't know how to change strings or understand truss rod mechanics. It has been decades since I did a Gibson, and I specifically asked about any hacks that may help keep my setup mostly intact. Any tricks I would have forgotten over the years.

And as a non Gibson player for those decades I wasn't sure how much change in action or relief might occur dropping a gauge.

thanks for all the suggestions though. job went great. I just measured the thumbwheel height and it was easy to put back in place. kept the same string gauge.

Glad I sold the doubleneck around 1980 though. hated stringing/tuning that thing.

 

[Offshore Angler]

Well here’s what you’re missing. You’re not setting the bridge height. You measure the action, not the bridge.

 

[Offshore Angler]

Charlie, I have no issues to solve so there is no reason to change. If your slots are “meticulously cut” there should be no binding. If the slots are good and you still have binding I would suspect pencil lead was used for lube. Modern pencils will result in a clay-like residue that will cause tuning problems.