Murphy Lab brittle finish (2022 ML R9)

[Karl BP]

Hello all, first time here - thanks for letting me join the community! I have a lefty R9 Murphy Lab Ultra Light (pictures below) that sounds like heaven (serial number dates to March 2022).

Question to fellow owners - is it to be expected that the finish flakes off even without dinging it, for example just by playing the guitar sitting? As you will see in the picture below, there is a spot on the edge that sits on my leg that is starting to come off. Now, I really don‘t mind it if it is normal and part of the charm. But I also own a Heavy Aged that for some reason does not do that (although I have had it only since January).

I see two alternatives: keep on playing and add more, or sell (Gibson does not consider this to be covered under the warranty).

Many thanks!

 

[ADP]

I'm not lefty, so don't know how easy or difficult it is finding another, but I wouldn't tolerate that myself. I'd move it on.

 

[Thunder Dump]

This was a known defect with the early ML guitars where the lacquer would flake off in chunks. It progressively gets worse, such as this:

Gibson was claiming that the finish is not covered under the Lifetime Warranty (and even blamed owners for not doing proper climate acclimation with the guitars) but I believe some people were able to get Gibson to exchange the guitar for a new one. I don't think anyone was successful in getting Gibson to refinish one, so if you really like it you may be stuck with it.

 

[Karl BP]

This was a known defect with the early ML guitars where the lacquer would flake off in chunks. It progressively gets worse, such as this:

Gibson was claiming that the finish is not covered under the Lifetime Warranty (and even blamed owners for not doing proper climate acclimation with the guitars) but I believe some people were able to get Gibson to exchange the guitar for a new one. I don't think anyone was successful in getting Gibson to refinish one, so if you really like it you may be stuck with it.

Thanks! I can say the lacquer coming off of my guitar is definitely not looking like this… I understand from the AMA thread with Matt Koehler at Gibson that there about 100 guitars that had that extreme flaking and they got replaced. But still, it seems quite brittle if playing the guitar sitting triggers the lacquer to off it small bits.

 

[Tommy Tourbus]

Man that's a drag, especially considering the stoopidly high upcharge for ML aging

 

[Baracus]

My Dec '21 has just started chipping on the neck.
Guitar has been on the rack in my room, chips weren't there a few days ago, now they are.

Very disappointing, this is not how guitars age. And I'm in the same position, what do you do? Try and sell it with chipping starting?
Or keep it and and end up with a guitar with no finish on it in 10 years (or less).

Definitely should be a warranty issue. But I also don't want to send it back as it's a great guitar

Chipping is only small, for now. But Unnatural.
Sort of crazy, and disappointing

Plus I'm in Aus, makes it all even harder




Here's the guitar in action:

Video: R9 hand picked top from Peach

and a pic:

 

[Karl BP]

My Dec '21 has just started chipping on the neck.
Guitar has been on the rack in my room, chips weren't there a few days ago, now they are.

Very disappointing, this is not how guitars age. And I'm in the same position, what do you do? Try and sell it with chipping starting?
Or keep it and and end up with a guitar with no finish on it in 10 years (or less).

Definitely should be a warranty issue. But I also don't want to send it back as it's a great guitar

Chipping is only small, for now. But Unnatural.
Sort of crazy, and disappointing

Plus I'm in Aus, makes it all even harder


View attachment 21758View attachment 21759

Here's the guitar in action:

Video: R9 hand picked top from Peach

and a pic:

View attachment 21760

Hey Baracus, I have decided to sell it... Unfortunately, it looks like both your guitar and mine are facing the same thing. it does not look like the crazy flaking from the earlier ones, but still, pretty disappointing. Best of luck trying to deal with Gibson's Warranty team. As far as they are concerned, this is not a faulty finish but part of the deal when you get the aged ML finish.

My guitar is also fantastic otherwise (sound and playability). And being a Lefty, these are pretty rare. But I also have a Heavy Aged R9 that does not have that issue. The finish looks and feels different. Not sure why exactly, but that is the one I will keep...

Good luck!

 

[Torshalla]

If it s a great guitar, there s always the option to have it re finished… expensive and kind of crazy to have to re finish a guitar that cost extra for its original finish though…
Thanks for posting anyway, does not make me feel confideny about buying a ML…
Imagine if the 50k Greenies or 20k ones end up that way…

 

[corpse]

You'd think Tom might step up?!
That is shyte right there.
Welcome BTW- wish it was under better circumstances.

 

[Wizard1183]

If it s a great guitar, there s always the option to have it re finished… expensive and kind of crazy to have to re finish a guitar that cost extra for its original finish though…
Thanks for posting anyway, does not make me feel confideny about buying a ML…
Imagine if the 50k Greenies or 20k ones end up that way…

They’re heavily aged missing lacquer and paint. So no one would even notice.

 

[Torshalla]

They’re heavily aged missing lacquer and paint. So no one would even notice.

Well if the lacker starts to peel off around the KH initials it could become someone else’s Greeny haha

 

[Baracus]

If it s a great guitar, there s always the option to have it re finished… expensive and kind of crazy to have to re finish a guitar that cost extra for its original finish though…
Thanks for posting anyway, does not make me feel confideny about buying a ML…
Imagine if the 50k Greenies or 20k ones end up that way…

Yes that is the crux of it, pay more money (significantly) for their "top of the line" finish. Just to have it fall off and then have to pay again to have it refinished properly
Diabolical really.

Even weirder is it would still be a Murphy Lab by name but he (Murphy) would be getting the credit for the new improved/correctly done finish.

Whichever way i go it seems likely it will be devalued for resale should I ever want to move it on.

I had a 60th R9 before this and in hindsight think the VOS is the way to go. The ML finish is also a little sticky in feel.
For reference the guitar in my profile pic is a replica with an incredible finish and light aging, the ML feels nothing like that finish, not does it feel like my vintage guitars

All that being said the ML does have a lot to like, great top, player, neck size is perfect for me - noticeably smaller than the 60th which I was surprised by.
I guess I'll just see how it progresses. I may email Peach in the meantime just to see what they say.

 

[60thR0]

If you lose some finish does it mean moisture will get in and affect the tone or tuning stability etc? I know that aged guitars get a treatment to any unfinished areas to prevent this and at the start of manufacture of any guitars (even USA) they are very careful to make sure the moisture content is 5-9% or whatever, I can’t remember the target exactly.

Same question for all those vintage guitars that have lost finish- I can’t believe they are all being sent to luthiers to have their patches treated so wouldn’t the wood moisture content increase over time (depending on where you live obviously) which affects tone (presumably negatively- not sure the sound of moist wood is going to be so great).

 

[Torshalla]

If you lose some finish does it mean moisture will get in and affect the tone or tuning stability etc? I know that aged guitars get a treatment to any unfinished areas to prevent this and at the start of manufacture of any guitars (even USA) they are very careful to make sure the moisture content is 5-9% or whatever, I can’t remember the target exactly.

Same question for all those vintage guitars that have lost finish- I can’t believe they are all being sent to luthiers to have their patches treated so wouldn’t the wood moisture content increase over time (depending on where you live obviously) which affects tone (presumably negatively- not sure the sound of moist wood is going to be so great).

I have an 87 standard that has been played heavily and has lost a lot of finish… no wood treatment… no issues…

 

[John550]

That "well known "defect ( limited to about 100 guitars ) " was limited to the dark cherry back. Now seems to shows up when you have any questions about a Murphy Lab finish. There may be a different reason causing the problem on his , it also may be an anomaly. The ultra heavy aged back is a light brown in color . No way the clear would come off the one I had . But they should do something for those guys where its so new and not due to extreme temp / moisture swings .

 

[NINFNM]

Return it if you can. The new one you'll get will also be as good but hopefully without selfdestruct finish

 

[Wizard1183]

The paint isn’t even sticking to the wood. Weird. Rushing them out the door before the paint dries. My 74 LPC has lacquer flaked off on a couple spots and the white paint is still on it so….idk? ML I guess is what it’s all cracked up to be ?

 

[Standard Magic]

Could it be possible that the ML's that haven't flaked yet will, in a matter of time?

 

[Wizard1183]

Could it be possible that the ML's that haven't flaked yet will, in a matter of time?

Flaking is fine. Of course not as bad as pictures have been? But paint needs to adhere to the guitar. Only wear or chipping should take paint off

 

[McCarthy]

This is what you are paying for with ML nitro finishes, to be clear. TM even discusses this in articles published about the new processes - the finish is intentionally brittle to mimic the feel of old nitro finishes of vintage Gibsons. It’s ‘dryer’ and cures ‘harder’ than the standard modern nitro finishes.

It’s an artifice of sorts and an expensive one.