How HOT is HOT?

[skay]

I have a question regarding the rating of bridge pickups, in particular what would be considered HOT by P.A.F standards? Is anything over 8.0k overwound and therefore HOT? I have a bridge pickup with a resistance of 8.4k and it seems to drive my amp too much, is this a powerful pickup by P.A.F standards?

Plus, is dc resistance the same as output? If a pickup has a low dc resistance, does that automatically mean it will have a low output? (as in volume)

 

[Hamerfan]

No, it has much more to do with number of windings (different wire has different resistance on the same length) and the strength of the magnet and million things more. 8.4k with 42 gauge PE wire is more than 60ies PAFs (they had 7.5k but with an A5 Magnet), but some 50ies PAF (different types of Magnets!!) have sometimes more than this (bad quality control at that time ;-).

 

[Yelly]

Most pickups use the same guage of copper enamel wire, so DC resistance is certainly a very significant part of how hot a pup sounds.

Type of magnet is the major other variable affecting pure output.

Variables like scatter winding, tightness of winding, microphonics and the like are more significant to tone and clarity rather than output.

PAFs would typically be 8K +/- 10% so yours would be on the higher side of this tolerance but not would normally be classed as hot HB. The Dimarzio Super Distortion (possibly the first readily available hot pup) for instance is many K above a PAF at 14K.

Of course all HBs are very sensitive to the distance from the string. I would try dropping them off a little.

BTW what amp is being driven too hard?

 

[seyfert]

That resistance valued does not state very much over the sound of the PU. In the statements stronger is that Resonant Frequency (kHz) and the induction, valued in H (Henry), which is to be measured however very difficult. For sure is that the old PAF were very differently in the amount of the wire windings and so had from 6.5 kohm until more than 9 kohm.
If it interest´s or help´s, I measured several pairs of Burstbucker´s, in the average! BB 1 has 7.7, BB 2 has 8,1 and the BB 3 has about 8,7 kohm.

 

[skay]

The amp being driven too hard is a Vox AC30HW. The replacement pickup I put in have alnico IV magnets with a DC of 8.4K (bridge) and it seemed to hit the front end of the amp alot harder than the 8.3K alnico II Burstbucker 2 it replaced.

The extra mids, or 'normal' mids maybe, of the alnico IV made the amp compress much more than the 'scooped mids' of the Burstbuckers. The tone stack on AC30's are very interactive and take a little time to get to grips with, I didn't realise it would be radically different simply changing magnet type, but the difference/increase in drive proved to me there is a huge difference.

I am running the power section (master volume) flat out with a Hotplate (on -4dB) and this extra compression/drive just resulted in a massive squashed sound. I'm having the bridge humbucker rewound (unwound?) to 7.7K and will look at the way I run my amp.

My style of playing is predominatley 'rhythm', with some poor excuse for lead guitar thrown in here and there, so I'm never after massive gain, so that's why I was asking about HOT pickups as that's exactly what I DIDN'T want.

Thanks for the insights though.

 

[VOLTAGE]

any paf type over say 10K is too over the top for me
the only 10K i like is the angus bucker and i like the 9.7K duncan blues trembucker a lot that one is a real good pup :dude

 

[DonP]

The amp being driven too hard is a Vox AC30HW. The replacement pickup I put in have alnico IV magnets with a DC of 8.4K (bridge) and it seemed to hit the front end of the amp alot harder than the 8.3K alnico II Burstbucker 2 it replaced.

The extra mids, or 'normal' mids maybe, of the alnico IV made the amp compress much more than the 'scooped mids' of the Burstbuckers. The tone stack on AC30's are very interactive and take a little time to get to grips with, I didn't realise it would be radically different simply changing magnet type, but the difference/increase in drive proved to me there is a huge difference.

I am running the power section (master volume) flat out with a Hotplate (on -4dB) and this extra compression/drive just resulted in a massive squashed sound. I'm having the bridge humbucker rewound (unwound?) to 7.7K and will look at the way I run my amp.

My style of playing is predominatley 'rhythm', with some poor excuse for lead guitar thrown in here and there, so I'm never after massive gain, so that's why I was asking about HOT pickups as that's exactly what I DIDN'T want.

Thanks for the insights though.

What was wrong with the Burstbucker 2? You say you wanted a lower output pickup (I think - for rythm, right?) but you went for a hotter wound and hotter magnet pickup. Does that make sense?

Also, Burstbuckers have mismatched coils. This causes the mids to phase cancel out, giving you an even more scooped EQ. If your replacement pickup has matched coils, it would fatten the mids up even further.

 

[skay]

You are completely right, but I found all this out AFTER I had bought and installed them! I wasn't actually after a lower DC pickup, I was only looking to cut the highs and tighten up the lows. They BB's were not BAD pickups but sometimes the 'shrill' factor' could annoy and I would sometimes lose definition in the lower registers. I thought as the pickups were 0.1K difference then it wouldn't behave any differently. Boy, I was wrong. The increased gain was unplanned and unwanted and I was very surprised at the change in tone, especially the mids, which added to the overall gain. AII and AIV are worlds apart, but now I know that and can work with it, I'm so glad they are.

The replacement pickups are scatterwound (by hand) and have, I think, mismatched coils which are possibly why they sound very open (mmm nice) and the AIV seems to tame the top end without sounding dull, and the bass is much clearer on the lower strings. The bridge is 7.7K and neck 6.9K so they are lower DC but with stronger magnets (AIV) and this seems to be the magic combination for me!

 

[DJRJMASS1]

I have a question regarding the rating of bridge pickups, in particular what would be considered HOT by P.A.F standards? Is anything over 8.0k overwound and therefore HOT? I have a bridge pickup with a resistance of 8.4k and it seems to drive my amp too much, is this a powerful pickup by P.A.F standards?

Plus, is dc resistance the same as output? If a pickup has a low dc resistance, does that automatically mean it will have a low output? (as in volume)

DIMARZIO SUPER DISTORTIONS 13.65 K! CLASSICS!

 

[DJRJMASS1]

What was wrong with the Burstbucker 2? You say you wanted a lower output pickup (I think - for rythm, right?) but you went for a hotter wound and hotter magnet pickup. Does that make sense?

Also, Burstbuckers have mismatched coils. This causes the mids to phase cancel out, giving you an even more scooped EQ. If your replacement pickup has matched coils, it would fatten the mids up even further.

Or,.....DiMarzio Super Distortions! 13.65 k. They are the KINGS of humbuckers!!! Hands Down!!!!

 

[DJRJMASS1]

DIMARZIO SUPER DISTORTION HUMBUCKERS are the Kings of All Humbuckers for a reason. They just sound DAMN GOOD in Every style of music!!!! Classics

 

[bluesky636]

Guess you like Dimarzio Super Distortion humbuckers.

19 year old thread.

OP hasn't posted since 2015 so I doubt he cares anymore.

IMHO, Super Distortion pickups suck.

 

[hankjmcc]

Guess you like Dimarzio Super Distortion humbuckers.

19 year old thread.

OP hasn't posted since 2015 so I doubt he cares anymore.

IMHO, Super Distortion pickups suck.

TBH they kinda do suckl. They were fun when I was younger and doing metal but once I got a high output PAF (Throbak PG102B) it smoked it. The super Distortion was definitely better suited to my Jackson Rhoads though.

 

[renderit]

I kinda like 'em when I'm on memory lane...
Now I wanna maybe's try 'em again to see if my remembery is right.

 

[Wilko]

I still like them. I sold all of my guitars that had them. I do have a very worn original one from the mid 70s in a box somewhere.

 

[lure555]

Kinda funny how our tastes over time. My first good guitar was a used Gibson The V that had an SD Invader in the bridge. I was not in an Air Supply cover band. Moved on to SD Hot Rails in my Strat for many years. Nowadays 8K-9K is the sweet spot. Even though I'm using a modeler I prefer to let the "amp" do the heavy lifting.

 

[Wilko]

two, wired for series/parallel "Dual Sound"!

 

[GlassSnuff]

Like the Red Sox against the Yankees, I always liked Duncans. Never really tried Dimarzios, but the ones on the shredder guitars we sold weren't very encouraging.

I had a JB I put an A2 in... wonder if the OP would have liked that?

 

[Wilko]

Here are two SD JBs wired series/parallel!

I preferred the DiMarzio. Worked fine for Al DiMeola!

 

[lure555]

Here are two SD JBs wired series/parallel!

I preferred the DiMarzio. Worked fine for Al DiMeola!

Love that guitar! I saw Al a few weeks ago and he played his old Custom the entire electric set. He was incredible.