Reflect_ion
New member
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2020
- Messages
- 14
Hi all, I'm kind of new here. A long time lurker, been out of the game a while also... but now a 1980 Heritage 80 Standard is coming my way. Prior to my purchase I did some research and this place contained a lot of info on the Heritage line. Thanks for that!!
Hence, I'm posting this topic here also (I also posted it on the other forum)...
Reading into the Heritage line, the 4# serial got me all intrigued: I read from several posts here (and on the other forum / on the Vintage&Rare blog / ... ) that there was no code or pattern behind it but they were just random numbers. Some posts on forums mention it was an idea from Bruce Bolen (then head of R&D).
That got me thinking to list all the Heritage 80 Standards and Elites I could find on the forums, on Youtube, on online stores, through Google, and see if there is a logic in this Norlin quirk... Bonus was that along the way I found the Les Paul estate sale which contained 0001 Standard and 0001 Elite. Would it match with the serials that these were really the first? And would there be a logic in the 4# serial?
I put in all in Excel and here are my findings with 104 guitars found:
- the x-axis is the date based on the serial number
- the y-axis is the 4# serial
- the red dots represent a Heritage 80 Standard
- the blue dots represent a Heritage 80 Elite
For me that's a clear correlation!!
- I have found no guitars prior the 0001's from Les Paul's estate
- There are some outliers, that is to say some mixups between Standards and Elites
- The 2 low 4# serials in '81 are a goldtop and a wine red... so quite unique on their own, maybe they adopted a new count for those?
- I found 2 Standards with the 2617 code
So a clear correlation but still it's weird that some 4# serials are not in a logic sequence compared to their regular serial.
I read that a serial number is applied to a guitar the moment the neck is set (the heritages all had a specific headstock so no mixing with regular production guitars was possible)... maybe the 4# serial was applied afterwards when the guitar was really finished and they made the paperwork/certificates?
Some considerations if all of the above is more or less true:
- It seems they started with the Standard and 2 months later with the (necks of the) Elites... maybe in the meantime they already made the Elite bodies? Because all of a sudden there is a huge catch-up done by the Elites.
- It seems no (necks for) the Elites were made between September and December '80.
- Production really slowed down after mid '81.
- As of July '82 the body shapes were normal again (no pointy horns anymore)
Of course this does not prove they actually made +- 3,300 Standards and +-1,350 Elites, but it seems to good to be true doesn't it?
I have screenshots of all the aboves for reference
And if anyone's interested I can share the excel file in one way or another (I also inventorized the colors, the tops and body shapes).
What do you guys think? Utter waste of time or nice to know?
Feel free to add pics of your Heritage with the serial if I may add it in here.
Hence, I'm posting this topic here also (I also posted it on the other forum)...
Reading into the Heritage line, the 4# serial got me all intrigued: I read from several posts here (and on the other forum / on the Vintage&Rare blog / ... ) that there was no code or pattern behind it but they were just random numbers. Some posts on forums mention it was an idea from Bruce Bolen (then head of R&D).
That got me thinking to list all the Heritage 80 Standards and Elites I could find on the forums, on Youtube, on online stores, through Google, and see if there is a logic in this Norlin quirk... Bonus was that along the way I found the Les Paul estate sale which contained 0001 Standard and 0001 Elite. Would it match with the serials that these were really the first? And would there be a logic in the 4# serial?
I put in all in Excel and here are my findings with 104 guitars found:
- the x-axis is the date based on the serial number
- the y-axis is the 4# serial
- the red dots represent a Heritage 80 Standard
- the blue dots represent a Heritage 80 Elite
For me that's a clear correlation!!
- I have found no guitars prior the 0001's from Les Paul's estate
- There are some outliers, that is to say some mixups between Standards and Elites
- The 2 low 4# serials in '81 are a goldtop and a wine red... so quite unique on their own, maybe they adopted a new count for those?
- I found 2 Standards with the 2617 code
So a clear correlation but still it's weird that some 4# serials are not in a logic sequence compared to their regular serial.
I read that a serial number is applied to a guitar the moment the neck is set (the heritages all had a specific headstock so no mixing with regular production guitars was possible)... maybe the 4# serial was applied afterwards when the guitar was really finished and they made the paperwork/certificates?
Some considerations if all of the above is more or less true:
- It seems they started with the Standard and 2 months later with the (necks of the) Elites... maybe in the meantime they already made the Elite bodies? Because all of a sudden there is a huge catch-up done by the Elites.
- It seems no (necks for) the Elites were made between September and December '80.
- Production really slowed down after mid '81.
- As of July '82 the body shapes were normal again (no pointy horns anymore)
Of course this does not prove they actually made +- 3,300 Standards and +-1,350 Elites, but it seems to good to be true doesn't it?
I have screenshots of all the aboves for reference
And if anyone's interested I can share the excel file in one way or another (I also inventorized the colors, the tops and body shapes).
What do you guys think? Utter waste of time or nice to know?
Feel free to add pics of your Heritage with the serial if I may add it in here.
!!