Early to mid 60's SG necks?

[fernieite]

Hi all. I was just reading on the Provide.net site that the neck joints on early SG's were quite weak and unstable? Any opinions? Is the info on Provide.net accurate regaring the desirability of these models? Thanks.

They recommend 1963 and 64 above all the others for some reason. The neck tenon length is commented on too.
Anyone know if Standards, Specials, Customs and Juniors have the same neck shape?

I ask because I'd like to eventually get a vintage 61 - 65 Special (Small Pickguard / nickel hardware)

http://home.provide.net/~cfh/gibson5.html#sgstd

 

[garywright]

Anyone know if Standards, Specials, Customs and Juniors have the same neck shape?

I think they do, but I could be wrong ...neck shapes seem to very, even within the same year ..but not purposely from model to model (at least I think not )

 

[frazettafan]

My '61 Special and '61 Junior were both skinny, my '64 is a bit fatter but my '59 had the fattest of the three - the '59 was perfect IIRC.

 

[MIKE LEAF]

Hi all. I was just reading on the Provide.net site that the necks on early SG's were quite weak and unstable



[URL="http://home.provide.net/~cfh/gibson5.html#sgstd"]http://home.provide.net/~cfh/gibson5.html#sgstd[/URL]

Where does he say that they were 'weak and unstable'?

He states that the size of the tenon was increased in 1963.

It is known that SG´s can have neck issues due to the original design of the neck /body joint , but the same problems have occured with LP Specials.

 

[fernieite]

My mistake. He seems to be implying that the neck joint was weak and that the neck was very thin.
The 63's and 64's had thicker necks and stronger joints then?
Thanks.

 

[OKGuitar]

There is no question that SGs have a poorly designed neck join. They changed it at least 4 times because of problems. Part of the problem in the early LP/SGs which have a beautifully designed smooth heel, is that the neck is held in place by glue on only one plane. Consider that the neck tenon of a Les Paul and a 335 is held in place on three planes-the bottom of the tenon and the two sides. The early SG tenon is just a flat flap not the true mortise and tenon of a Les Paul. The glue gives up and the neck just about falls off-held on only by the strap button. They changed it in late 63 but the glue pattern was, I believe, the same. They changed it again in 66, I think and again in 68. These changes didn't happen on January one so I'm really just guessing on the dates. The strongest of them seems to be the 68 where the body was extended far up the neck and the join was larger. It didn't look as cool but it worked a whole lot better. I'm not sure about specials and jrs being the same. Standards and Customs have the same join but not necessarily the same neck size. My 63 has a wonderful wide neck with huge shoulders. My 62 is a little bit flatter with less shoulder. My late 64/early 65 also had a wonderful neck-a lot like a 64 335-fat but not too fat. Below: earliest to latest.

 

[MIKE LEAF]

I find it strange that the first ones introduced in late 60 and beginning of 61 had the heel, and then after that they went for the smooth joint, and then back to the heel again?

I was surprised to find that out in the earlier '1960 SG project' thread.

It not mentioned in any of the books , including Rob Lawrence first LP book which has a great deal of info on the first 'sculptured Les Paul Standards'

I have seen at least two or three early examples with the heel, both ink stamped and very low impressed serialnumbers

 

[skydog6653]

The neck joint on my '63 Jr. I didn't care for the neck on this one. It was wide and shallow.