2003 R7 Brazilian

[kink56]

isn't African Mahogany Korina? Also are ALL Historics made with Swietenia Macrophyllia? Some seem to have very white wood, and some very dark reddish wood.

 

[Trans-Am]

Sapele comes to mind as an alternative to the real Mahogany used in acoustic instrument like Martins etc.

Cheers:salude

 

[wizard333]

You're right. "Honduran Mahogany" is a marketing term and or colloquial name for Swietenia Macrophyllia, or "Bigleaf Mahogany. It grows all over central and South America. Certain coasta plain regions particularly arounf Honduras and surrounding countries in Central America have stands of this wood thar is the most desirable, but good wood can be found all over CA and Eastern coastal regions as far north as Mexico. Destructive logging techniques forced the Honduran government to make logging of Swietenia Marchophylia illegal, but recently, I believe in 2005, legal logging began again in Honduras due to a new program that allows eco-friendly harvesting. Swietenia Macrophylia is the only true Mahogany that is used for musical instrument production. African Mahogany, also used for musical instruments is not a Mahogany at all, although it is a perfectly suitable species for musical instruments. Philipinne Mahogany is used for flooring and not MI production. So in short, if you have a guitar made of Mahogany, it IS "Honduras Mahogany" even if it comes from Venezuela or Mexico.

EXACTLY.

How does having a "vintage accurate" FRETBOARD but NOT a "vintage accurate" BODY WOOD make it more attractive to someone? That boggles my mind. The body wood will have far more affect on the instrument than Indian vs Brazil rosewood on the board that is half pearloid inlay anyway.

Personally, I wont even consider a guitar made between 98 and 2006 due to the khaya instead of macrophyllia issue. But hey thats me, if non-accurate wood with braz board does it for you to the point of actually paying more, knock yourself out!

But don't expect me to understand.

 

[Dino_k]

isn't African Mahogany Korina? Also are ALL Historics made with Swietenia Macrophyllia? Some seem to have very white wood, and some very dark reddish wood.

Korina is yet another type of lumber from Africa in addition to Sapele and Khaya, and when I was a kid it used to be called Limba in the lumber yards. I don't know what Gibson has been using for the Historics, but had assumed that it was Mahogany from Central and South America and therefore none of the African varieties. As an aside, these are all very nice woods for alot of woodworking purposes, whether guitars, furniture or carpentry. And they ain't cheap!

But as you may have noticed, there is alot of interest in accuracy to original Burst build specs. And for what we pay for these guitars I don't think that is being unreasonable. If Gibson says "the closest yet to original build details" and then switches to a different type of wood, say Balsa, people have a reason to point it out and complain.

Regarding the color issue: there is alot of natural color and grain variation in mahogany lumber, even from within the same log (these are REALLY BIG LOGS!). Typically, one thinks of an even light red or reddish brown color as being "mahogany". But it can come in orangish, dark brown, light pink or even a salmon-y color, all of which can be really nice wood.

Ultimately there is no real rule on which color or grain pattern makes the best instrument. A real craftsmen will work the piece, constantly tapping it during construction, to listen for resonance and timbre (no pun intended). However, in large production shops they do not have the luxury of taking this approach. Perhaps someone that is more familiar with the Custom Shop can give us some detail on how the luthiers evaluate the wood during the build process.

 

[Black58]

Honduran mahogany or Brazillian rosewood dildos : which is best? Find out tonight, on Jerry Springer!

 

[kink56]

Honduran mahogany or Brazillian rosewood dildos : which is best? Find out tonight, on Jerry Springer!

Many girls prefer Ebony board.

 

[lpjunkie]

Many girls prefer Ebony board.

You're bad! :2cool

 

[Black58]

:lol Probably a more slick feel with ebony. ... or somethin'. :rofl

 

[325-at-2pm]

Fast forward to June 2010.

What a 2003 R7 Brazilian worth these days? Were they really not made of mahogany??

 

[Chef Greg]

Where have YOU been, bro' ??la

I'd say $4400-ish (give or take 10%)?

 

[325-at-2pm]

Chef Greg, thanks for the quick answer. :salude

Been lurking lately here on the LPF, but for the last 4 years or so I've mainly had to work hard to survive as a small business owner in manufacturing. It's been a "Mean Old World", but I'm starting to see some light. :lol

I still have the late '55 tunematic GT, that was converted to '57 specs. You helped me cancel all of those bogus auctions with my guitar's photos that were hijacked on eBay.

Glad to see that you're still here on the LPF and that things are going strong here.

:2cool

 

[wizardmc]

.

 

[325-at-2pm]

Thanks for the clarification on the mahogany.

I've been in the rain forests of both Belize and the Yucatan several times and have seen those mahogany trees. I know in Belize they are "protected".

I didn't realize that the Yucatan also supplied 50s guitar wood. I guess I was too busy thinking about the movie Apacalypto as I was hiking thru those jungles and climbing those temples. It makes sense that the Yucatan would be a source as well, given it's right next door to Belize......................

Do you also think $4400 +/- 10% is today's range for a Brazilian R7, like the Chef??

:dude:

 

[sharq attaq]

Those who OWN a BRW get the facination, those who don't own one, well, they don't own one!

I had an '03 BRW R6. I couldn't get rid of it quick enough. It was a turd. Just because it's got a BRW fb don't mean it's going to be a great guitar. Of course, could've been the substandard P-90s of the time.
...or maybe the cheap ass fake bumblebees.

Either way...although I may have hickied myself moneywise, I traded even for a CS '65 relic strat that is one of my favorite guitars to this day.

 

[Chef Greg]

Chef Greg, thanks for the quick answer. :salude

.... still have the late '55 tunematic GT, that was converted to '57 specs. You helped me cancel all of those bogus auctions with my guitar's photos that were hijacked on eBay.

Glad to see that you're still here on the LPF and that things are going strong here.

:2cool

That's one old guitar I regret not pulling the trigger on... it's a good one!

BTW, in this market it''s really difficult to say what most things are truly worth, IMO (ps-- is your email still the same??)

 

[325-at-2pm]

BTW, in this market it''s really difficult to say what most things are truly worth, IMO (ps-- is your email still the same??)

You're right about this market. If you wait and have patience for the right buyer to come along you can make out OK. I've sold a few things on eBay lately, and if you don't panic and are willing to relist a few times, you'll eventully be alright. You even get surprised by an occasional Buy-It-Now.

Yes, my email is still the same. I think its even accessible via LPF.

:teeth

 

[triggeron6string]

I'm board.

 

[sharq attaq]

I'm board.

yeah...let's talke about Brazilian waxes instead!

:hee

 

[325-at-2pm]

OK, here's a hand grenade to liven you up. :lol

Fake bubblebee caps as definitely a laugher. They look real, but would you rather put something in the control cavitiy that looks like a turd, but sounds like the real thing on your Historic?

I'm sitting here with a 1957 LP Jr in my lap wondering how the heck somebody can look at this fingerboard and tell what kind of wood it really is. Is it Brazilian Rosewood? You can't see very much grain. The specs say brazilian. It doesn't look like the wood on a 1957 Martin D28. Hmmmmm.

What's so ridiculous about some of this stuff is that hypothetically speaking, from June 1st of 1959 until June 30th of 1959, Gibson could have run into a bad batch of brazilian and used something else for fingerboards. A backup material.

The backup fingerboard material could have been installed on the best flamey LPs of the 1959 and what are people going to say????? It's NOT Brazilian?? The fingerboard was changed?? It says right here in my Vintage LP spec book that this is brazilian rosewood on my June 1959 fingerboard.

Bottom line is that things like that happened at Gibson from 1955-1961, and perhaps something like that could happen at Gibson today. In fact, I know it's happened from informed sources in the Custom Shop on things like screws, etc. Maybe not for a whole month, but it happens in manufacturing.

I guess whatever floats your boat. I guess some people think that if it looks like a bumblebee, it must sound like a bumblebee, and it sounds just like a real bumblebee..................:ha

 

[delawaregold]

The past few months have I have seen Brazilian prices firming up a bit.
It is still very much a buyers market, but I believe the prices have deflated
about as much as they are going to.