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Exposing the "evil doers"...

j45

j45

Active member
Joined
Jun 14, 2002
Messages
9,081
TW59 said:
The "inner circle" is a figment of the imagination of someone who knows they aren't in it.

You're fine, as you have always been. :salude
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Thanks Tom, just kinda taking the piss (with that post) as my British friends say. I always laughed at the "inner circle" conspiracy that was thought to have been going on somehow on the forum. The fellows who have been consistent here have always shown great hospitality, sincere open communication, and acceptance to me with everything concerning vintage guitars. Just sad that there are, in fact, opportunists with motives other than the love of great vintage instruments. I would have never guessed by the participation and seemingly legitimate credentials that the one I referenced was a bad egg from the get-go. I missed John's warnings somehow and all other red flags. Never did business with him but I feel there are other dealers who are less than honest when it comes to vintage. Having been once accused of fraud here in a way that I thought was self serving and highly misrepresentative of the actual circumstances, (I guess that eventually happens to everyone when prices for guitars are so inflated by a moving target of criteria) my feelings are if you want to buy an "expensive" vintage guitar, you'd better damn well know why you want it and base what you are willing to pay on your own personal desires, then take full responsibility for your decision, regardless of market and investment potential.
 
CDaughtry

CDaughtry

Les Paul Forum Co-Owner and Moderator
Joined
Jul 16, 2001
Messages
12,646
j45 said:
The format change and then now reading this exposing the evil-doers...I get more confused every day... I still remember all the talk here about the 'inner circle". Was Phil Winfield ever in it? There was a time it seems like he would have been...buying and displaying the PG burst for everyone to see and play... ....and if so when did whoever is in it decided he was out...which he certainly appears to be now. Also, was I ever in it and if so, when was that? If I wasn't, did I ever get close? And who's in the "inner circle" now?
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The topic of "inner circle(s)" is a fascinating one. I actually think there are myriad inner circles that intersect at various points. Let me explain: through the three decades of my collecting activities, I have met, and become friends with, various people who share similar interests whom I have grown to trust. Those guys are my "inner circle" in the vintage world. There are others who include some, but not all, of the guys I trust, in their "inner circle."
There are then of course, several "big names" in the vintage world who belong to a lot of these "inner circles." The ATC, Vic, Tom W., and Uncle Lou immediately come to mind. Those guys, because they are in so many inner circles, are going to hear about bursts for sale before 1) the general public, and before 2) those of us whose inner circles don't intersect as often with other "inner circles." Those of us whose inner circle intersects less often than the big boys will hear about bursts before the general public, but generally after those mentioned above. Because of my friendship with the ATC, I have the benefit of hearing about them almost immediately, even though my inner circle intersects less often than others. There are also others, such as Joe B., who, because of his burst buying prowess, is included in many of those inner circles, even though he is new to the game(by our old fart standards).
Does that make sense?:jim



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jimmi

jimmi

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2012
Messages
2,078
yeti said:
So Phil went into bankruptcy and stiffed some folks who did business with him, right?
Sounds like business as usual and good luck trying to get those laws changed towards a tougher stance on bankruptcy and PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. In the meantime Donald Trump, who stiffed investors to the tune of billions becomes a successful brand, TV celebrity, folk hero and presidential candidate. Funny, aye?
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Trump could be running over nuns but it doesn't detract from Phil being a dishonest douche. Easy to minimize when you aren't the one out a few thousand.

Honestly it was easy to spot. Guitars repeatedly presented as what they where not, convenient excuses as to why that was or artful dodges "it wasnt really for sale" BS. Doesn't make him less of a villain.
 
landminelenny

landminelenny

Les Paul Froum Member
Joined
May 11, 2010
Messages
3,204
Circles

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ATC

ATC

New member
Joined
Sep 12, 2014
Messages
36
Mo,Stick to Photography! I like pictures better than Drawrings.
 
T.Allen

T.Allen

Moderator
Joined
Sep 11, 2014
Messages
2,662
This is my "inner square". Nothing ever intersects and I suspect they might be empty. :hee

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Y

yeti

Guest
jimmi said:
Trump could be running over nuns but it doesn't detract from Phil being a dishonest douche. Easy to minimize when you aren't the one out a few thousand.

Honestly it was easy to spot. Guitars repeatedly presented as what they where not, convenient excuses as to why that was or artful dodges "it wasnt really for sale" BS. Doesn't make him less of a villain.
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I'm not minimizing anything. The problem, among other things, seems to be the bankruptcy laws and Trump is ,like it or not, the king of bankruptcy....and being celebrated for it.
IMO Phil or his spouse (is he married) shouldn't be allowed to own anything or start any new venture until he repays his debts in full. If he won't pay he should go to jail. Same goes for the Donald and a gazillion other "clever" guys who use the laws to screw honest people out of their money.
 
B

Banker

Guest
j45 said:
Was Phil Winfield ever in it? There was a time it seems like he would have been...buying and displaying the PG burst for everyone to see and play...
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Just for clarity Kerry, Winfield never owned Greeny, the money was put up by a third party as part of a wider arrangement until it came crumbling down because of the nature of the man.
 
renderit

renderit

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 19, 2009
Messages
10,967
yeti said:
I'm not minimizing anything. The problem, among other things, seems to be the bankruptcy laws and Trump is ,like it or not, the king of bankruptcy....and being celebrated for it.
IMO Phil or his spouse (is he married) shouldn't be allowed to own anything or start any new venture until he repays his debts in full. If he won't pay he should go to jail. Same goes for the Donald and a gazillion other "clever" guys who use the laws to screw honest people out of their money.
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As I recall we went through a war because of that and a few other reasons? Sounds like you need to move to the other side of the pond. Not covering for Phil, I believe there is a particularly low level of hell for him and his kind. Trump? Don't know, I don't really play in those circles. I'm more the farmer than the CEO anymore. I think at that level those boys steal from each other. Not my problem. He never lost any of my investment money that I am aware of.

And a nod to the Banker, damn glad to have you back. Missed your banter here.

OK, nuff' serious chit for a while, I'm going back out to raise hell.
 
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