Question For Phil47UK

Gibsononly · Sep 29, 2006

+3 Amazing playing. It's only recently that I have been making the attempt at that connection to my playing. It's pretty freakin' difficult.

phil47uk · Sep 29, 2006

I'm really enjoying this thread. Makes a bloody change from talking about tenons and green inlays............:rofl

Vengarov Masterclass.
Watch Venagrov’s passion and interpretation of a passage. How he makes analogies of certain situations and people to the music in his teaching… The fat cook for instance.
Ok so it’s violin… But guitarists take note of this stuff….

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WX8Y-IiN8cE&mode=related&search=

Jason Becker Paganini Caprice….Notes upon notes and about as much expression as a wet haddock. Last one home gets a bag of peanuts guitar shredders syndrome.
Get these fret board wankers to turn of their effects racks and let’s here what it really sounds like.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBPyjOUlhp0&mode=related&search=.

And now the same piece with light and shade played by an 18 year old girl..Note that unlike Becker who basically plays every note with the same velocity Su Meng has given the piece some thought. Contrast. Beautiful, even though her hairstyle may not be quite in Jason’s league.
Ok.. One can argue the more clinical steel rod up the arse approach which obviously some classical players have, but then rock is rock and classical is classical and both genres of music are a century or so apart....
Personally in this case, the Becker thing leaves me cold. There is absolutely no light, shade, feeling or contrast in that performance whatsoever. Just cascades of notes, albeit they are in the correct oder, for notes sake.
A classic case of musical diarrhoea I'm afraid. It just doesn't say anything to me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChZ_YRVk4Mc&mode=related&search=

And for a bit of fun about the whole thing.
Hey! Have you ever noticed that a lot of these shredders all seem to have names like Italian ice cream salesmen?:laugh2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evTTHS9hwvU&mode=related&search=Yngwie%

orbifold · Sep 30, 2006

Thanks for the links Phil. I really enjoyed those. That Petrucci video
made me laugh, Su Meng was incredible, Vengarov was a lot of fun,
and Becker, well that reminded me of my dentist's drill

phil47uk · Sep 30, 2006

Hi Orbifold,
Don't you just love people like Vengarov. They are so animated about their music.

A great quote re music I read once said.

' The notes I handle no better than many pianists. But the pauses between the notes - Ah, that is where the art resides'. Arutu Schnabel.

phil47uk · Sep 30, 2006

Gibsononly said:
+3 Amazing playing. It's only recently that I have been making the attempt at that connection to my playing. It's pretty freakin' difficult.

The secret is to let go and be yourself.
The ultimate technique is to have no technique, but of course you have had to have the technique in the first place to be able to transcend it.
A bit like the Karate expert.. He doesn't aim at the wood, but beyond it.

The next time you practise, let every personal emotion you have ever known come out.. The good times you have had. The tradgedies in your life.. The really great and happy times. People you loath with a passion.. People you love more than anything else.

Connect this to your playing and you will notice great things start to happen.
Don't think CTS pots.... Old wood etc etc.. Forget that bollocks.. Think life.. Think you!.

sliding-tom · Sep 30, 2006

Amazing that nobody's mentioned singing yet. To me a great guitar solo (or a solo on any other instrument) should have a vocal quality. Listen to Ray Charles and Aretha Franklin: the human emotion they relate to their listener with all the subtle shades and twists and turns are so pure and real, yet sound so effortless.
Like B.B. says: "First I sing a line and then Lucille takes over and sings a line.""

phil47uk · Sep 30, 2006

sliding-tom said:
Amazing that nobody's mentioned singing yet. To me a great guitar solo (or a solo on any other instrument) should have a vocal quality. Listen to Ray Charles and Aretha Franklin: the human emotion they relate to their listener with all the subtle shades and twists and turns are so pure and real, yet sound so effortless.
Like B.B. says: "First I sing a line and then Lucille takes over and sings a line.""

Dead right there my man...
However I did mention singers in an earlier post though sliding-tom..
See my post and sound clip of Mahalia Jackson above. #38

Hey! And lets not forget dance.
I love the capture of the Celtic feel and rhythms in River Dance.

Try working out the timings in this one guys...What a band!
The bloody thing is going from 4/4 to 7/8 with bits of 4/4 3/4 6/8 alternating all over the bloody place during the main theme towards the end.

A good piece of homework for anyone wanting to sit down and work it out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoJHJWhIS2U&mode=related&search=

Phil.

Gibsononly · Sep 30, 2006

phil47uk said:
The secret is to let go and be yourself.
The ultimate technique is to have no technique, but of course you have had to have the technique in the first place to be able to transcend it.
A bit like the Karate expert.. He doesn't aim at the wood, but beyond it.

The next time you practise, let every personal emotion you have ever knwon come out.. The good times you have had. The tradgedies in your life.. The really great and happy times. People you loath with a passion.. People you love more than anything else.

Connect this to your playing and you will notice great things start to happen.
Don't think CTS pots.. Pigtail tailpieces... Old wood etc etc.. Forget that bollocks.. Think life.. Think you!.

I do tend to get caught up in not sounding like Jimmy page or Mike Bloomfield. That is great advice. I am waiting for my new R8 to show up on my doorstep so I can really put some practise time in. :biggrin:

phil47uk · Sep 30, 2006

Gibsononly said:
I do tend to get caught up in not sounding like Jimmy page or Mike Bloomfield. That is great advice. I am waiting for my new R8 to show up on my doorstep so I can really put some practise time in. :biggrin:

Great stuff Gibsononly. Let's see some pics when it arrives..:salude

Here's how not to do it and then how to do it....

The Malmsteen Vai and Satriani.. Who’s got the biggest dick rendition of Voodoo child..What an absolute heap of crap.
What on earth does Malmsteen think he's doing trying to sing. He sounds like Arnold Swartzenegger trying to learn his lines . And wearing that sort of outfit when you resemble the lead character from Moby Dick aint a good move either.:rofl

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7gC-EBE__g&mode=related&search=

Hendrix.. Now let’s hear how it should be done. Mistakes and all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4PPwtAWDVU&mode=related&search=

refin · Oct 1, 2006

phil47uk said:
Great stuff Gibsononly. Let's see some pics when it arrives..:salude

Here's how not to do it and then how to do it....

The Malmsteen Vai and Satriani.. Who’s got the biggest dick rendition of Voodoo child..What an absolute heap of crap.
What on earth does Malmsteen think he's doing trying to sing. He sounds like Arnold Swartzenegger trying to learn his lines . And wearing that sort of outfit when you resemble the lead character from Moby Dick aint a good move either.:rofl

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7gC-EBE__g&mode=related&search=

I guess it's all good for the people who like that kind of "Wild West" approach to guitar,where music is a competitive sport.
The first few notes that Vai hit were pretty good,before the typical yawnfest.I like to hear someone who paces themself with speed in certain places,so it is effective.I'm as guilty as anyone of sometimes letting my fingers run ahead of my feel.Yngwie looks like someone forced a potato into a surgical glove---as I would look too!
All said and done,people play and listen to guitar (and music in general) for different reasons---to some,it ain't about the emotion,but the rush of energy and speed.If they are happy there,so be it...I just don't personally see the art in it.

phil47uk · Oct 1, 2006

refin;1391056 where music is a competitive sport. [/QUOTE said:
That's a great analogy you made there refin... 'A competetive sport'

Yep! That just about sums it up. I think you have nailed the fretboard wanking fraterity on the head in one there..:salude

Phil.

sliding-tom · Oct 1, 2006

G3: Guitar -o- lympics threefold! I like that analogy "Who's got the biggest dick!" LOL!
Sorry Phil - had read that post on Mahalia (though she isn't exactly "blues" ), but already forgot about it while reading further on.

Alanj · Oct 4, 2006

Well I guess the OP was not happy - but I thank him for his question. I have enjoyed reading this thread. Great information. I am new around here and I have found it hard to coax the emotion out and play slow with feeling. But threads like this and Phils responses have given me ideas to try. Thanks you guys for the great posts above.

Alan

phil47uk · Oct 5, 2006

Hi guys,
Ok... Gospel as opposed to blues then sliding-tom...But they both share the same roots anyway.

Thanks Alanj.. I try to help in my strange sort of way.
What's great about this forum is that you have all sorts imparting their knowledge in one field or another.
Mine doesn't happen to be on the technical side of things re guitar construction etc, but more from a working musicians point of view.

I think a healthy balance is what it's all about.

Phil.

moonpie · Oct 5, 2006

Let's see...question for Phil....let's see....hmmm....OH!! I've got one!

Phil,
What is the air-speed velocity of an unladen swallow?

phil47uk · Oct 5, 2006

moonpie said:
Let's see...question for Phil....let's see....hmmm....OH!! I've got one!

Phil,
What is the air-speed velocity of an unladen swallow?

56.7 mph in a 60 degree dive, with a prevailing 12mph headwind.

orbifold · Oct 5, 2006

We should not focus on how fast the swallow is diving but how
much inspiration, commitment, and feeling went into that dive...
Was the dive beautiful? that's what I really want to know :hippy

Now, I'll try to find some nice youtube examples of diving
swallows

Seriously though Phil, keep 'em comin' :dude:

moonpie · Oct 5, 2006

:applaude :applaude

sliding-tom · Oct 6, 2006

phil47uk said:
Hi guys,
Ok... Gospel as opposed to blues then sliding-tom...But they both share the same roots anyway.Phil.

Sorry, Phil, didn't mean to be a wisecrack here.

:wah

phil47uk · Oct 6, 2006

orbifold said:
We should not focus on how fast the swallow is diving but how
much inspiration, commitment, and feeling went into that dive...
Was the dive beautiful? that's what I really want to know :hippy

Now, I'll try to find some nice youtube examples of diving
swallows

Seriously though Phil, keep 'em comin' :dude:

Ah.. Now if we are talking a LPF model swallow.. It often doesn't really matter how fast it flies, or what inspiration it has.. It usually never get's as far as that....But! It has to have the right coloured tail and beak though.:laugh2:

sliding-tom......As long as it doesn't sound like Moby Malmsteen, it's ok with me.:salude

Phil.

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