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throbak or wizz?

P.A.F

Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2016
Messages
78
i'd like to change pickups on my TH59 les paul. I have the chance of buying both a wizz set (alnico II) and a throbak (alnico II), which one should i buy? i'm not looking for the one that sound best , i'm looking for the one that sounds exactly like a real P.A.F. with all it's pro and cons
I have watched a couple of throbak videos and they're amazing... i mean have a maniacal attention to details and specs, wizz have a killer reputation too, what do you think?
right now i have my LP is equipped with standard TH humbucker (with alnico IV)
 
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Señor Verde

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Jan 13, 2005
Messages
621
I had a set of Throbak SLE-101 with alnico II magnets and and as much as I respect what Jon has done and his attention to detail, I didn't care for them in any of the guitars they were in. I think the SLE 101 Plus might have been more to my liking, but haven't tried them.

I have a couple sets of Wizz standard winds, with Alnico 4 and do like them better than the Throbaks I had. I currently have Wizz Jimmy Page pre-'72 in one guitar I like a lot, but those have unoriented A5.

To be honest, my main Les Paul has Wolfetone Legends. I've never owned a real PAF, but the Legends get that particular guitar that old time sound I hear on my favorite old recordings. I also like them in my ES-335's.
 

duaneflowers

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Aug 13, 2013
Messages
2,522
I have one set of Throwbacks (DT-102) in my Epi ES-345 where they sound ok, but they just didn't jive with any of my Les Pauls. I currently have roughly 20 sets of Wizzes (pretty much every set of variation they offer) and to my ear they are closest to the original 1960 PAF set that is in my main playah.

I think that the main thing to consider is that all PAFs sounded the same, yet different. They had pretty much the same wind patterns and parts, but the impedances and magnets (and to some extent wire variances) fluctuated quite a bit lending to that tonal variation. The wind pattern and parts creates the foundational build upon which the variations in impedances and magnets account for the different offerings. I find that true with many of the aftermarket masters as well... they stick to similar wind patterns and parts and change things up as they go along. To that end it seems that people that like Throwback REALLY like Throwback and people that like Wizz REALLY like Wizz. Kind of like red and black licorice.

There are many other winders I really like as well... Jim Rolph, James Finnegan (Rewind), Dave Stephens, Boogie J (in Japan), Bharat Kundekar (OTPG) to my ear give me the greatest consistent offerings most in line with what I consider true PAF tone. Again, to my ear, Ellis, Klein, Florance, Kinkade, Allen and Holmes are all worth mentioning as top tier productions as well. I have all of these in various Les Pauls right now and love them all. But in regard to your question of Throwback vs Wizz I would go with Wizz every single day of the week and twice on Sundays. :salude
 

P.A.F

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Joined
Mar 8, 2016
Messages
78
For what I know most wizz pickups are alinico IV , isn't the least common magnet on vintage PAFs? I think most were alinico II and V . Anyway listening on YouTube wizz sound more musical, but it's YouTube and it's not realistic. These wizz I'd like to buy are alnico II, same as throbaks
 

ourmaninthenorth

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Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
7,119
I've played PAF's in numerous guitars, enough to make the following personal statements -

No two sets sounded the same, they were in different guitars, in different rooms, through different amps. I was in a different mood on each occasion. I'm not claiming false incompetence to my hearing abilities, I'm merely accepting the variables concerned and the lack of a single undisputable reference point in terms of sound.

If it just has to be a set of PAF's, then only a set of PAF's is going to scratch that itch.

If however you want a set of superb pickups by a whole host of necromancers who are winding them at present, you're going to get just that, a superb pair of pickups.

Like buying guitars, play enough, eventually something will sound just right to you.

Like buying guitars, it's a bloody expensive dodge.

Like buying guitars, your ears are the ultimate judge.

I'm using a set of ReWinds. They suit the guitar, and are giving me a lot of enjoyment in use, somebody will hate them.

Such is the nature of this game.

Good hunting.

:salude
 

Mr. Legit

Active member
Joined
Sep 11, 2016
Messages
112
I have had at least 4 sets of Wizz and ThroBak pickups. The ThroBak MT-102B set was my favorite, and I did prefer this particular set of ThroBaks to all the Wizz pickups I had tried at the time(2014-2018). I do prefer Alex’s customer service compared to Jon’s, but I have yet to try Alex’s most recent offerings, so maybe his tone has changed especially the NOS wire ones. They are just different takes on the sound of a PAF. Most importantly, you’ll find that this is a crap shoot and you’ll spend a ton of money trying to be and find the most vintage correct. I don’t have either in my guitars now because I prefer OTPG and Jim Rolph pickups as my go to. I also find the Custom Buckers these days do a pretty good job, and I try my best not to modify my guitars now, so really I wouldn’t recommend you modify a True Historic. You’re in for one hell of journey on your wallet if you aren’t satisfied, GOOD LUCK!
 

Tim Plains

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Aug 1, 2013
Messages
795
The correct answer is both. No, really, both. They both do the exact same thing and the only way to know which will sound better in your guitar is to get both and then sell the set you like less.
 

GreenBurst

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Mar 5, 2004
Messages
748
The Wizz website shows everything is 'out if stock' and there's a message saying the webshop is currently closed as they've had too many orders.

Both are good, but maybe do Throbak this time. I know one of their sets is on a Black Friday sale right now through Monday.
 

renderit

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Jan 19, 2009
Messages
10,951
Depends on the guitar.

I have had a few that sounded crappy with one and great with the other.

Really.
 

P.A.F

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Joined
Mar 8, 2016
Messages
78
Thank you everyone! I think I'll go for wizz because they sound more open and musical to me ( I have only listened to demos on internet) , if I don't like them I'll change them for throbaks in the future. Anyway the stock neck pickup will go in my tele neck position!
Throbak really intrigue me because of the maniacal attention to details but listening to demos I prefer wizz. In the end we have to care about the sound, even though the historical accuracy stimulate my GAS ( A LOT!!!)
 

Nick-O

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Aug 12, 2015
Messages
223
The correct answer is both. No, really, both. They both do the exact same thing and the only way to know which will sound better in your guitar is to get both and then sell the set you like less.

I hope you love them, but I still think this ^^^ is your best bet, buy both sell the one you don't prefer.

.02¢
 

El Gringo

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Joined
Apr 8, 2015
Messages
5,657
My most wonderful story with ThroBak . It was either late 2017 or early 2018 when I found my Patent Sticker T-Top pickups from my childhood Les Paul Custom which I had long ago removed for first Dimarzio , then Seymour Duncan , followed by Gibson 57 Classic in the neck and 57 Classic Plus in the bridge . So I called Mr. Gundry to make arrangements to send him my Patent Sticker T-Tops to have Gold Covers installed , and after a most pleasant chat on the phone where we discussed if I wanted to wax pott the pickups of which I decided not to after speaking with Mr. Gundry and instead to have him use double sided tape with a drop of silicon on the slug coil area under the double sided tape , which I was told that should make it nice and tight and not to have squeals and such . So a few weeks later more like 10 days I get the pickups back and they were beautiful , I was sold on the covers at first sight when I seen them on www.throbak.com , from the dimples to the traditional look of the front versus what Gibson uses now and they were the ones that designed them in the golden era . Then a few months later I needed to replace a very bad set of pickups ( very bad !!!!!!! ) so after researching and reading up on Mr. Gundry's website I knew right away what I wanted - ThroBak-MXV-SLE-101 Plus humbuckers with A5 magnets . I wanted a vintage PAF pickup with more output and with A5 magnets for the mid range growl/thunder/tone and sustain for days thru my Marshall 2555X's loaded with Celestion Vintage 30 speakers , and I also knew I would need to have these pickups wax potted as playing thru high gain Marshall's squealing would be undesirable and most unwanted . So I get the first set and it was love at first listen coming from my Les Paul thru the Marshall 2555X's. It was like an Epiphany , I mean such a rich and glorious tone that my ears had not heard before in any pickups that I had ever used , I mean this was mind shattering and goose bumps and tingles all the way into my ear drums . I know your reading this and going yeah right , sure they do . I am dead serious like a heart attack . How good you might ask ? Well I now have them loaded in 8 Gibson Les Paul's , with 2 more sets sitting at home waiting for the next 2 M2M Les Paul's to be built which then will make it 10 Les Paul's loaded with ThroBak finest ! I have spent enough on these 10 sets to buy a brand new Gibson Custom R series guitar and these are that great and I put my money where my mouth is or my Keyboard as I type this . One fella asked me why I don't diversify or change up my tone offerings as to have more variety or different spices /flavors ? . My response to that is when I find something that great I am going to go hog wild and run with it and enjoy the ride to tone heaven and they really are that GREAT ! Mr. Gundry is most wonderful to speak with and his knowledge is immense as is his patience to answer each and every question of mine and to teach me along the way as well . Such a fine Gentleman that I wish everyone I come into contact with could be like him , with such an amazing personality and knowledge and able to deliver the excellence at such a high level of quality and excellence !!!!!!!!!!!!! I most recommend every thing THROBAK . P.S. tell him El Gringo sent you :jim I Love THROBAK
 
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duaneflowers

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Aug 13, 2013
Messages
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Thank you everyone! I think I'll go for wizz because they sound more open and musical to me ( I have only listened to demos on internet) , if I don't like them I'll change them for throbaks in the future. Anyway the stock neck pickup will go in my tele neck position!
Throbak really intrigue me because of the maniacal attention to details but listening to demos I prefer wizz. In the end we have to care about the sound, even though the historical accuracy stimulate my GAS ( A LOT!!!)

Excellent decision... but I think you'll also find that Wizz is just as historically accurate as Throwback even though I don't really believe that historical accuracy is all its cracked up to be. I mean you can't really see anything under the surface, so does it really matter what's underneath when we are ultimately only concerned with tone? It was the Ron Ellis set in my Lee Roy Parnell Sig that tuned me into this. Ron's humbuckers sound amazing even though they are probably the furthest thing you can get from historically accurate PAFs. For background, Ron is an electrical engineer for a National Fusion Energy Program at General Atomics in San Diego and, for his own enjoyment, he decided to reverse engineer the PAF, as opposed to going the historical accuracy route, and the results sound every bit as good as many of the PAF sets out there and better than most... all done from a modern engineering perspective. They have everything that PAFs have in terms of the rich overtones, subtle nuances and touch sensitivity that PAFs are famous for yet none of the historical accuracy. Having pointed that out, and even though I understand it is not entirely rational, I still prefer my Wizzes, OTPGs, Stephens Design and Rewinds... probably for their historical accuracy. :spabout
 

NYCBURST

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May 11, 2016
Messages
288
I own both... The wizz are a little more microphonic, the throbak have a little more bite. I personally think Stephens design are the best replicas of an original PAF... All depends on what strikes your fancy.
 

Tommy Tourbus

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Jan 1, 2005
Messages
871
I haven't used either, but I have Onamacs, Wolfetones, and Bareknuckles in my Historics and I can't imagine better sounding PAF style pickups. Can't see how much better wizz or throback could possibly be, and at almost double the price...
 

somebodyelseuk

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Joined
Jun 10, 2020
Messages
454
i'd like to change pickups on my TH59 les paul. I have the chance of buying both a wizz set (alnico II) and a throbak (alnico II), which one should i buy? i'm not looking for the one that sound best , i'm looking for the one that sounds exactly like a real P.A.F. with all it's pro and cons
I have watched a couple of throbak videos and they're amazing... i mean have a maniacal attention to details and specs, wizz have a killer reputation too, what do you think?
right now i have my LP is equipped with standard TH humbucker (with alnico IV)

WHICH specific PAF?
I've not read through the posts, but I'm sure it's already been said. No two PAFs sound the same.
You probably already have something as close to A PAF as anyone else does.
Only true answer is leave the money in the bank and use what you've got, or try em all and stick with what you like. Go back through old threads here and you'll find what was the Holy Grail five or ten years ago is now considered nothing special. I expect that to be the case ten years from now, as well.
 

jwalker

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Dec 10, 2004
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2,592
I hope you enjoy your new pickups. If you decide to buy a set of ThroBak pickups in the future feel free to email any questions you may have through the ThroBak website. Those emails come to me. We make a variety of P.A.F. repros to cover a wide range of the best vintage P.A.F. tones. So if you need any advice on which to choose we can help and also explain what makes ThroBak P.A.F. repros unique in the pickup world.

Jon
www.throbak.com
 

Professortwang

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Dec 16, 2009
Messages
761
I love Throbak pickups! I have DT 102, Pg set, and two sets of the 101 pickups. They all sound stellar, the 101 pickups are my favorite.
 

duaneflowers

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Aug 13, 2013
Messages
2,522
I haven't used either, but I have Onamacs, Wolfetones, and Bareknuckles in my Historics and I can't imagine better sounding PAF style pickups. Can't see how much better wizz or throback could possibly be, and at almost double the price...

Which set of Onamacs do you have? What can you tell us about them? I had never heard of them before your post but it seems that, like Ron Ellis, Kerry Learned has his own unique/original way of winding. Color me intrigued! :hmm
 
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