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Black parts anomaly

goldtop0

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One thing that I'm aware of is that even though there are very few '57 GTs with black parts(pickguard, pickup surrounds etc) another '57 with the cream parts(and there are considerably more of these LPs) is considered higher in value.
Can any of you guys explain why.
 

DANELECTRO

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Feb 24, 2003
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Probably the same reason that bursts are more valuable than humbucker Goldtops, even though the 57 Goldtop is essentially the same guitar (but more rare). It’s not necessarily about rarity, but what is desirable to collectors.
 

sws1

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The rings themselves are more valuable on cream guitars. Lots of black rings around. Not cream rings. That's a 10k surcharge there.

Double white PAFs also command more money...and many times, you can't even see them. Perplexing.
 

CptZar

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The reason is, like said above, that black parts were still available, when they stoped producing Les Pauls in 1960. It took 14 years until cream parts showed up again with the very few first Humbucker LPs in 74. Black pickguards for Humbuckers came back with the first black customs in 1968.

A common problem with Les Pauls is, that many have been stripped off of their cream parts, and black parts were installed instead. A set of cream pickups rings goes for 10K. Add the pickguard and the toggle switch chip and you can make some serious money.

Pick up rings then were taken from ES-175 and others, as well as the pickguard, which was cut accordingly. However you can see the marks left by the rubber used on the 175, if you know were too look at. Check www.mojoaxe.com for details.

Black parts LPs were only produced in the beginning of 1957. I am not sure when production started, but I guess it should be March, as they still produced P90s in the beginning of 57. Burstserial.com is a big help. If a guitar does not fall in the serial number range for black parts published there, one should at least double check. Also the caps are help to date the production date. If caps are from late 57 chances are, it was a cream part guitar once.

But what I learned in this forum, you can never be never be sure with Gibson.

And I do think, they just look cool.
 

S. Weiger

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The rings themselves are more valuable on cream guitars. Lots of black rings around. Not cream rings. That's a 10k surcharge there.

Double white PAFs also command more money...and many times, you can't even see them. Perplexing.

How about 1960 Doublewhite PAFs with gold plating? Are they as valuable as the nickel plated ones? :hmm
 

CptZar

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How about 1960 Doublewhite PAFs with gold plating? Are they as valuable as the nickel plated ones? :hmm

I could only think of the 345s. All archtops, beside the 175, have a smaller spacing of the pole pieces.
 

garywright

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No they're not.............that look is more fashionable..........makes the LP look slimmer:lol

though not “correct” ..an aged green/goldtop with black rings and double-whites may make for a very cool look :hmm
 

S. Weiger

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Unopened double whites are the most valuable. They're like diamond jewelry you can't wear.

Same value if they're gold plated?

I ask because my 1960 ES-355 has DW unopened PAF's. But they are gold plated (of course).

BTW, sorry for the thread derail :salude
 

sws1

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Same value if they're gold plated?

I ask because my 1960 ES-355 has DW unopened PAF's. But they are gold plated (of course).

BTW, sorry for the thread derail :salude

Using logic, I'd say there were worth less since there are fewer guitars in need of gold PAFs. But sometimes, logic doesn't apply. So I can't say for certain.
 

S. Weiger

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Using logic, I'd say there were worth less since there are fewer guitars in need of gold PAFs. But sometimes, logic doesn't apply. So I can't say for certain.

ok, thanks for trying :)
Hypothetical, one could wipe off the remaining gold plating (not much left anyway) to have kinda 'nickel' version, but to enjoy the white plastic, obviously you'd have to open the pickups. And since all soldering is untouched by other than Gibson in 1960, it is out of the question.

It's this baby:
https://www.atbguitars.com/store/product/1960-gibson-es-355-tdc-mono-1960es355tdcmono/

There, now I stole the thread :peace2
 

goldtop0

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Interesting to note, the only DWs for sale that I've seen over the years have been on the Marks Guitar Loft site.
Both covered and uncovered pairs have being listed at US$10k..........just sayin'.

Funny how the thread has turned from black to white...........:hmm:lol.........I'm now looking for the grey.
 

Jeff West

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Maybe this is a good place to ask, as I've forgotten if it's known, what was the story on the pg of Jeff Beck's first '59 sunburst in '66? The guitar otherwise had all the expected cream plastic, and DW PAFs x 2 as well.
 

CptZar

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read the first three words of your quote from me..is English not your first language ?

I just wanted to emphasise and agree with you , that doubles whites can't be found on a 57. That's why I quoted you. Why so offensive?

And English is not my first language.
 
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