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  1. #921
    Les Paul Forum Member fakejake's Avatar
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    Re: Valuable information to consider when evaluating the authenticity of a vintage bu

    Quote Originally Posted by Zapper View Post
    Hey guys, to save another 'victim' having to read through 23 pages and 900 comments of this thread to work out whether he's been ripped off or not, I thought I'd record a quick video to summarise the issues and things to look out for. If I've missed anything, please leave a short explanation in the youtube comment section (or below on this thread.... or both..!).

    Finally, thanks once again to all contributors for your help and expertise...

    Over & out!
    Ian Zapper Francis

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIUNT5D5RS0

    Nice casual shot of the Fezza at the end...

  2. #922
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner and Moderator CDaughtry's Avatar
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    Re: Valuable information to consider when evaluating the authenticity of a vintage bu

    Quote Originally Posted by guitplayer View Post
    Clown encouragement

    You’ve got to crack a few eggs to make an omelette.

  3. #923
    Les Paul Forum Member guitplayer's Avatar
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    Re: Valuable information to consider when evaluating the authenticity of a vintage bu

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    You’ve got to crack a few eggs to make an omelette.
    Yeah man, thanks
    " Never Mind Your Face, just show us your card"

  4. #924
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Valuable information to consider when evaluating the authenticity of a vintage bu

    Quote Originally Posted by fakejake View Post
    Nice casual shot of the Fezza at the end...
    Fezza?

  5. #925
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Valuable information to consider when evaluating the authenticity of a vintage bu

    Hey guys, I've just noticed that this thread now has 925 posts.... which I think makes it the biggest thread in the Vintage '52-'60 pub... Is that right? The Black Beauty thread currently has 923.

    Congratulations!!

  6. #926
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by mipstoo View Post
    Ok, I can't take this anymore.

    The guys from Elite Vintage Guitars (https://elitevintageguitars.com), Gareth and Ian (maybe his alrerego) think we are stupid but they are making a fool of themselves.
    My story with them started over a year ago when they had a fake 1963 "artic white" Stratocaster for sale and promoted on Facebook that was obviously a fake. Good advices from others were thrown out the window and the same what's happening here was happening then. The seller(s) defended his guitar by any means while others pointed out the many things that were wrong...

    Since, this Gareth Ayers guy has been posting and selling a lot of crap on Facebook... Including a fake '53/'54 goldtop, a fake '58 goldtop, one or two fake '56 goldtops and very questionable bursts ('58, '59,...)
    I was sent different pictures from contacts of him that were interested where it was plain obvious that some were bad copies.
    So this is not a stand-alone case.

    So, please stop legitimizing this crap and prevent others from taking a big loss on some forgeries fitted with period correct cases and parts.
    Hi mipstoo, fascinating to now read your post above.... Are we friends on Facebook? If so could you drop me a line please? There's something I'd like to ask you. And thanks for your very interesting & helpful post!

    Ian Francis, Billericay UK.

  7. #927
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by mipstoo View Post
    Those Police caps are pretty ironic now...
    And YES, they are pretty ironic now LOL...!!


  8. #928
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jumping@Shadows View Post
    I just had a look on elitevintageguitars.com and found the same ‘70s wine red Les Paul Custom for sale as in the group photo ‘Ian’ posted:





    Note the unusual bridge, grain line through the switch/upper bout and small white knick on bass side lower bout.

    Also, the ‘58 Les Paul’ is the same one held by Gareth Ayers in a FB post:







    What could all this be about?
    And Mr Y.... Can't believe you spotted my old Wine '79 Custom in their collection...! A great spot Sir..!!

    Strangely they've actually kept this guitar and paid me a decent price for it.... So at least SOME of their collection is genuine..!

  9. #929
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Valuable information to consider when evaluating the authenticity of a vintage bu

    It's fascinating (and hilarious..!) to read back through this thread with the hindsight we all now have....! And boy is there some good authentication stuff here too. Far better and more detailed than you'll find in any book..... Well done to all!!

  10. #930
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Valuable information to consider when evaluating the authenticity of a vintage bu

    I wonder if The Nile started out in life as one of these...? Excellent copies by all accounts....


  11. #931
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by GuitarMikey View Post
    Blimey Guitarmikey, I didn't notice my new numberplates before......! You got Photoshop for Christmas then eh?! Thanks for that.!

  12. #932
    Forum Moderator KennyF's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zapper View Post
    Blimey Guitarmikey, I didn't notice my new numberplates before......! You got Photoshop for Christmas then eh?! Thanks for that.!
    Those are yours? For some reason, I thought they belonged to Gareth...
    Stop by and get reacquainted with The all NEW Fender Forum

    "...put aside the alienation, get on with the fascination, the real relation, the underlying theme."
    Neil Peart (September 12, 1952 - January 7, 2020)

  13. #933
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by KennyF View Post
    Those are yours? For some reason, I thought they belonged to Gareth...
    Nah mine... ALL MINE..!!


  14. #934
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jumping@Shadows View Post
    The ‘chew’ mark in yours is smooth and not the result of the forstner bit catching the lip of the cavity after the inset for the pots was drilled and roughly tearing out the mahogany.

    More damning is that your cavity is the wrong shape at the 12 O’Clock position where the angled secondary route leaves a definitive V shape narrowing as it meets the maple floor- yours is square, plus the ‘lip’ for the control plate is too narrow in places.

    I’m pretty sure the pickup leg holes on the front cavity are too shallow as illustrated here:



    As for the headstock- it’s the exaggerated ‘dome’ on the top of the moustache which is clearly wrong, and notably similar to a fake ‘50s Les Paul in the UK I was shown last month:



    As for the wiring channel bring in the wrong spot, I’ve seen these vary a good deal in the ‘52-‘55 range, but taking all the red flags pointed out by a number of highly knowledgeable members who have scores of vintage Les Pauls at their fingertips for decades I’d take their comments on board, that it’s either the most anomalous original ‘60 Burst any have seen, or fat more likely a fairly crude replica, of the common kind seen regularly pop up in the UK every couple of years. YMMV etc
    I just reread this post of yours Mr Jumping Shadows...! I should have stopped my cynicism right here and demanded a refund immediately... As Trump would say... GOOD JOB....GREAT JOB....!

  15. #935

    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zapper View Post
    And Mr Y.... Can't believe you spotted my old Wine '79 Custom in their collection...! A great spot Sir..!!

    Strangely they've actually kept this guitar and paid me a decent price for it.... So at least SOME of their collection is genuine..!
    I, for one, would like to see a 79 mahogany necked Custom, when every other one had a maple neck. These guys are experts?

  16. #936
    Les Paul Forum Member Zapper's Avatar
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    Re: Restoring my 1960 'Burst... need HELP..!! :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Flogger View Post
    I, for one, would like to see a 79 mahogany necked Custom, when every other one had a maple neck. These guys are experts?
    As far as I am aware ALL Customs have mahogany necks. In fact the early Customs had mahogany bodies too..! The new ones still have mahogany necks. Did they change them for a period in the '70s then??

    https://www.thomann.de/gb/gibson_lpcstbk.htm

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