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60th Anni.`59 LP vs. Original or Historic Makeover

TM1

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
Messages
8,349
I'm seriously considering purchasing a 60th Anni. `59 LP. I was wondering if anyone here has compared them to an original 58-60 LP or to an Historic Makeovers.
I'd love to hear some opinions/observations. I'd like to know how the Bolivian Rosewood compares to Braz or Indian RW.
Thanks!
 

jimeh77

Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2017
Messages
119
If you have a chance to play all of them, do that. Otherwise check tons of YouTube vids and pick the one sounds the best.

That is how I roll.

I'm seriously considering purchasing a 60th Anni. `59 LP. I was wondering if anyone here has compared them to an original 58-60 LP or to an Historic Makeovers.
I'd love to hear some opinions/observations. I'd like to know how the Bolivian Rosewood compares to Braz or Indian RW.
Thanks!
 

guitplayer

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 8, 2008
Messages
2,114
I have both an Anniv and a 2005 HM.
Weight of the anniv. is better/lighter. The pickups I have in my HM are old duncan 59`s.
The pickups in the anniv are underwound. Tone is killer, but output not the same as the HM.
Pots in the anniv ,I would replace.
Board on the anniv. is very much like a vintage 50`s Braz. I think my HM has a Madagascar board.
Wood selection(top, back, board) on the wildwood anniv. is spectacular. Mine has aged plastic(s).
Unplugged... the anniv sounds better. FWTW.
Both guitars are very cool. I like the anniv better...at the moment.
 

Patek

Active member
Joined
Dec 4, 2015
Messages
415
I have an anniversary 59 LP and recently selling an original 53 LP

the specs are different in terms of pickups and bridge piece etc

however if we compare like for like, unplugged - the 53 is an entirely different league.

the fit and finish of the anniversary 59 is absolutely immaculate, it’s stunning, beautiful, perfect. But compare to a vintage guitar it has that slight plastic feel to it, as most modern guitars do. Gibson have tried but the nitro and finishing is nothing like an original
the patina of an original les paul is to die for no matter what the condition. Only HM and Florian, Bartlett etc have a chance of getting that accurate, Gibson ( TM) haven’t got a hope in hell and they look pretend from a Mile away

played unplugged the original LP vibrates in a way like no other guitar, the body and set the neck are like 1. They resonate and vibrate as if it was carved out of 1 piece of wood. The old original glues join together like glass. It has to be felt and heard first hand. No clip or video will pick it up

The bolivian rosewood on the anniversary 59 is far darker than the actual Brazilian on the 53. It’s the darkest board I’ve ever seen and could be confused with ebony in the wrong lighting. It’s super dark and absolutely gorgeous.

If I could afford it, I’d buy an amazing anniversary 59 - and have Florian strip it back and refinish it to correct 59 spec with decent patina. My current anniversary 59 has a quilt top so suits the modern style more. I’ve got bare knuckle miracle man pickups in it so it’s a metal machine. Doesn’t sound vintage at all anymore. The new custombuckers are too low output and chewy for me, they struggle with fast runs and cannot handle more than mid-gain before they flub out
 

TM1

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
Messages
8,349
Thanks Guys! I have two Historic Makeovers(a 2002 R-0 & a 2007 R-4) both have Braz boards and both got the full RDS treatment. I have a 1959 LP Special and a 1960 Melody Maker, double pickup. I have vintage pickups/pots/caps in all. I did put a set of early, early Pat.#'s in the Melody Maker. The difference between them and PAF's is only the sticker.
Most likely if I found one I like I'd send it to Kim to be refinished. I've played probably 50-60 original LP's so quiet familiar with all of the nuances of the originals. Thanks!
 

iknowpeanuts

New member
Joined
Feb 6, 2018
Messages
35
I have an anniversary 59 LP and recently selling an original 53 LP

the specs are different in terms of pickups and bridge piece etc

however if we compare like for like, unplugged - the 53 is an entirely different league.

the fit and finish of the anniversary 59 is absolutely immaculate, it’s stunning, beautiful, perfect. But compare to a vintage guitar it has that slight plastic feel to it, as most modern guitars do. Gibson have tried but the nitro and finishing is nothing like an original
the patina of an original les paul is to die for no matter what the condition. Only HM and Florian, Bartlett etc have a chance of getting that accurate, Gibson ( TM) haven’t got a hope in hell and they look pretend from a Mile away

played unplugged the original LP vibrates in a way like no other guitar, the body and set the neck are like 1. They resonate and vibrate as if it was carved out of 1 piece of wood. The old original glues join together like glass. It has to be felt and heard first hand. No clip or video will pick it up

The bolivian rosewood on the anniversary 59 is far darker than the actual Brazilian on the 53. It’s the darkest board I’ve ever seen and could be confused with ebony in the wrong lighting. It’s super dark and absolutely gorgeous.

If I could afford it, I’d buy an amazing anniversary 59 - and have Florian strip it back and refinish it to correct 59 spec with decent patina. My current anniversary 59 has a quilt top so suits the modern style more. I’ve got bare knuckle miracle man pickups in it so it’s a metal machine. Doesn’t sound vintage at all anymore. The new custombuckers are too low output and chewy for me, they struggle with fast runs and cannot handle more than mid-gain before they flub out

I actually was toying with the idea of sending my Sandy for the full makeover treatment to get the finish spot on but the luthier i go to advised me against it, saying that my guitar sounds really good as it is and he has seen bursts with the same shade of colour as mine. (i really hate the gooey, plastic-ky feel it has though)

His proposed alternative, should i want to scratch my itch was basically the same idea as yours – get the new anniversary 59 and send it to Kim. He said he's seen three or four come into this shop and he has been mightily impressed by how good they've been so far.
 

Patek

Active member
Joined
Dec 4, 2015
Messages
415
I actually was toying with the idea of sending my Sandy for the full makeover treatment to get the finish spot on but the luthier i go to advised me against it, saying that my guitar sounds really good as it is and he has seen bursts with the same shade of colour as mine. (i really hate the gooey, plastic-ky feel it has though)

His proposed alternative, should i want to scratch my itch was basically the same idea as yours – get the new anniversary 59 and send it to Kim. He said he's seen three or four come into this shop and he has been mightily impressed by how good they've been so far.

That would be my grail LP

aside from that, it would be to commission a Bartlett
 

CatManDoo88

Active member
Joined
Mar 3, 2019
Messages
156
Thanks Guys! I have two Historic Makeovers(a 2002 R-0 & a 2007 R-4) both have Braz boards and both got the full RDS treatment. I have a 1959 LP Special and a 1960 Melody Maker, double pickup. I have vintage pickups/pots/caps in all. I did put a set of early, early Pat.#'s in the Melody Maker. The difference between them and PAF's is only the sticker.
Most likely if I found one I like I'd send it to Kim to be refinished. I've played probably 50-60 original LP's so quiet familiar with all of the nuances of the originals. Thanks!

Is the 2002 R0 your Beano tribute or was that a different guitar you don't have anymore? If I recall correctly, there are some old posts about you having HM do a Beano tribute for you. If so, do you by chance have any pictures (the links in the old threads don't work anymore)? I'm curious because I just sent my Les Paul to HM for a Deluxe Makeover and the Beano Burst is my inspiration... Curious about how yours turned out.
 

Mats A

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Messages
799
Play and see what you like. Never understood this Historic Makeover thing. What’s the point? The Historic’s is great as they are.
 

pqs

Active member
Joined
May 31, 2019
Messages
109
I agree. Play and see what you like. With that said, my 60th Anniversary R9 was the best Les Paul I've ever played. I bonded with it the second I played it at the store. It felt so familiar to me, it was as if I had already owned the guitar for several years. I've had great guitar before and several stories of immediately loving the guitar, but never to this degree. I ended up selling several guitar, including a 2017 Standard HP and a 2017 R0(G0), both flawless, to pay for my R9. It was the best guitar purchase I've ever made.
 

Mats A

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Messages
799
I agree. Play and see what you like. With that said, my 60th Anniversary R9 was the best Les Paul I've ever played. I bonded with it the second I played it at the store. It felt so familiar to me, it was as if I had already owned the guitar for several years. I've had great guitar before and several stories of immediately loving the guitar, but never to this degree. I ended up selling several guitar, including a 2017 Standard HP and a 2017 R0(G0), both flawless, to pay for my R9. It was the best guitar purchase I've ever made.

What does GO on the R0 stand for?
 

pqs

Active member
Joined
May 31, 2019
Messages
109
What does GO on the R0 stand for?

Guitar Center exclusive runs of R0s, which have serial number starting with G0 instead of R0 (2016), CS0 (2015) or 0 (2017-present) depending of the year. The only differences are the lack of the thumb bleeders and a plainer, lightly figured tops more akin to R8s. Although, I've seen several, including mine, that were significantly more figured than the Gibson USA current standard AA tops. Yet some of the figuring can only be seen in certain angles. On mine, it was the figuring on the lower bout that weren't as pronounced when you looked down from a playing position. They also, as far as I know, are only available in Gloss finish and don't have a VOS option. As far as I know, each run was only available in one finish option. Mine was a dark burst, which I believe was based on the finish of the 1959 LP on page 129 of Beauty of the Burst, but I've seem earlier versions that were honeyburts as well as other bursts. Mine had long neck tenon and non-PIO bumblebee capacitors, which some call it fake bumblebees, that were used in other R0s prior to 2019. I think they are a great deal, since you get all the non-cosmetic features of a regular R0, but pay around $4,500 for a new one, which is $2,000 less than a regular R0.
 

latestarter

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 9, 2009
Messages
4,173
I'm seriously considering purchasing a 60th Anni. `59 LP. I was wondering if anyone here has compared them to an original 58-60 LP or to an Historic Makeovers.
I'd love to hear some opinions/observations. I'd like to know how the Bolivian Rosewood compares to Braz or Indian RW.
Thanks!

Just want to head back to the OP...

- I have a 60th R9, and a 40th R9...had R4's, 7's etc etc
- I've played a few bursts, a few Gold Tops. I own, and have owned a bunch of 50's Gibson's (Specials mainly)
- I have a view on where these 60th's are at vs an original.

In terms of neck shape and the binding...they got it pretty close. Smaller, less shoulder than recent versions. My '99 R9 has a larger neck and that has been the norm for most R9's I've played. I was reminded recently on a '58 burst how the necks were not as large as Gibson had been reproducing recently. I can say the same for my current '57 Special....it's almost a soft V with less shoulder than some monstrous R7 necks. So, in short, they got the neck right.

The Custombuckers are good. Maybe not great but certainly very good. The best Gibson's produced yet in terms of a PAF tribute pickup in my view.

The top on mine is excellent, and I've seen many similar. Wide choices on streaks, plain tops, highly figured seem to be available. The colours are good. The rear "red" is maybe slightly lighter than I'd like....but it's minor.

I have the rosewood board version and it's vintage realistic.

The fit and finish is FANTASTIC. I mean it. The frets are perfect.

The Lifton RI case is great, and if they'd produce the proper "waist" on these it would right up there with the 50's versions looks wise. But still, the Costa Rica cases are good.

The most amazing thing with mine is, it is only 1 digit away from my 1999 R9. I didn't even know until I had them side by side for a shoot! So cool!!! Now I need a 2009 R9 with one serial either way and I'm set! :hee

cr4hpVD.jpg


Together

XAyh1il.jpg


Headstock, one serial apart!

PfsjoeS.jpg
 
Last edited:

BJB63

Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2015
Messages
104
I owned a 60th anni and it had terrible fret board work. nut cut too deep the high e was resting on the first 3 frets,frets had marks all over them. returned it and sent a historic an RDS package with historic makeovers. it is 100% a better instrument. I had the guitar sent overnight from a good dealer they sent me another after letting them know of the issues, the following guitar didnt feel good enough to justify the price.
 

Mats A

Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2008
Messages
799
About the necks on Historics vs real Bursts and getting the necks right. I believe the originals differed a lot so is it possible to say that this is right? I’ve had some Custom Shop Les Pauls and some USA Les Pauls. I’ve never had any big issues with them. They’ve all been great guitars.
 

GotTheSilver

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Messages
2,433
Thanks for the detailed assessment. Can you speak about the tone of the 60th anniversary vs. the vintage bursts and goldtops you have experience with? For me, that is what it all comes down to. You mentioned the Custombuckers being good, but pickups can easily be changed out if you think you can get more from the guitar.

Just want to head back to the OP...

- I have a 60th R9, and a 40th R9...had R4's, 7's etc etc
- I've played a few bursts, a few Gold Tops. I own, and have owned a bunch of 50's Gibson's (Specials mainly)
- I have a view on where these 60th's are at vs an original.

In terms of neck shape and the binding...they got it pretty close. Smaller, less shoulder than recent versions. My '99 R9 has a larger neck and that has been the norm for most R9's I've played. I was reminded recently on a '58 burst how the necks were not as large as Gibson had been reproducing recently. I can say the same for my current '57 Special....it's almost a soft V with less shoulder than some monstrous R7 necks. So, in short, they got the neck right.

The Custombuckers are good. Maybe not great but certainly very good. The best Gibson's produced yet in terms of a PAF tribute pickup in my view.

The top on mine is excellent, and I've seen many similar. Wide choices on streaks, plain tops, highly figured seem to be available. The colours are good. The rear "red" is maybe slightly lighter than I'd like....but it's minor.

I have the rosewood board version and it's vintage realistic.

The fit and finish is FANTASTIC. I mean it. The frets are perfect.

The Lifton RI case is great, and if they'd produce the proper "waist" on these it would right up there with the 50's versions looks wise. But still, the Costa Rica cases are good.

The most amazing thing with mine is, it is only 1 digit away from my 1999 R9. I didn't even know until I had them side by side for a shoot! So cool!!! Now I need a 2009 R9 with one serial either way and I'm set! :hee
 

MikeSlub

Administrator
Joined
Jul 15, 2001
Messages
15,166
Hi Don,

The 60th Anniversary R9s are fine guitars. I've purchased two of them and love them both. Always hard to compare a reissue to a Burst - my Bursts have that "thing", that nuance in tone, clarity and feel that is an "X-factor". That said, I really like the new R9s and think you will be pleased with them - they feel good, look good, are fun to play, and sound awesome! Best of luck on your decision. :hank

60th Anniversary R9s:

2019_Gibson_Les_Paul_Historic_60th_Anniversary_1.jpg

2019_Gibson_Les_Paul_Historic_60th_Anniversary.jpg


The Bursts:

Four_Bursts_1.jpg
 

latestarter

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 9, 2009
Messages
4,173
Thanks for the detailed assessment. Can you speak about the tone of the 60th anniversary vs. the vintage bursts and goldtops you have experience with? For me, that is what it all comes down to. You mentioned the Custombuckers being good, but pickups can easily be changed out if you think you can get more from the guitar.

I do think the guitar will be improved with either some real PAfs or quality RI's. Acoustically, the guitar rings out loud, has that hollow knocky honk that indicates, at least in my experience, that there will some good sounds to be had. I guess I'll need to put in some different PU's to provide a more fulsome answer here.

About the necks on Historics vs real Bursts and getting the necks right. I believe the originals differed a lot so is it possible to say that this is right? I’ve had some Custom Shop Les Pauls and some USA Les Pauls. I’ve never had any big issues with them. They’ve all been great guitars.

That is true, but generally speaking the necks on RI's since forever ago have been on the larger side versus originals. A lot has had to do with the shoulder shape. Often, the RI shoulders are too D shaped. That would seem to have been improved upon. The binding is nice and thin too which helps the overall feel and is more vintage spec'd. The latest 59 style frets are excellent...a little lower than previous RI's but they feel great to play.

The neck shape debate is a bit like top carves. Plenty of bursts out there with subtle carves.
 

pqs

Active member
Joined
May 31, 2019
Messages
109
Just want to head back to the OP...

- I have a 60th R9, and a 40th R9...had R4's, 7's etc etc
- I've played a few bursts, a few Gold Tops. I own, and have owned a bunch of 50's Gibson's (Specials mainly)
- I have a view on where these 60th's are at vs an original.

In terms of neck shape and the binding...they got it pretty close. Smaller, less shoulder than recent versions. My '99 R9 has a larger neck and that has been the norm for most R9's I've played. I was reminded recently on a '58 burst how the necks were not as large as Gibson had been reproducing recently. I can say the same for my current '57 Special....it's almost a soft V with less shoulder than some monstrous R7 necks. So, in short, they got the neck right.

The Custombuckers are good. Maybe not great but certainly very good. The best Gibson's produced yet in terms of a PAF tribute pickup in my view.

The top on mine is excellent, and I've seen many similar. Wide choices on streaks, plain tops, highly figured seem to be available. The colours are good. The rear "red" is maybe slightly lighter than I'd like....but it's minor.

I have the rosewood board version and it's vintage realistic.

The fit and finish is FANTASTIC. I mean it. The frets are perfect.

The Lifton RI case is great, and if they'd produce the proper "waist" on these it would right up there with the 50's versions looks wise. But still, the Costa Rica cases are good.

The most amazing thing with mine is, it is only 1 digit away from my 1999 R9. I didn't even know until I had them side by side for a shoot! So cool!!! Now I need a 2009 R9 with one serial either way and I'm set! :hee

cr4hpVD.jpg


Together

XAyh1il.jpg


Headstock, one serial apart!

PfsjoeS.jpg


Thank you you so much for sharing your experience. That’s not the first time I heard the exact same comment about the neck of the original bursts. When I first played a 2019 60th Anniversary, that was my same reaction as well. It didn’t feel as chunky as R9’s of previous years. I conjecture that Gibson has listened to the comments about the neck on RI’s.

I ended up getting that first 60th Anniversary R9 because it was the best Les Paul I’ve ever played. Felt very familiar like I’ve owned it for a few years already.
 

TM1

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2003
Messages
8,349
Thanks Everyone! Much appreciated. I'll most likely get one and send it to Kim @ HM for a refin and maybe a Braz FB, depends on how it sounds. I'd probably get some more real PAF's or at the very least either ThroBak's or Wizz.
 
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