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Looking to buy a TH vs a 2018 Historic

jam81

New member
Joined
May 20, 2016
Messages
57
Hi,

I have been thinking about buying a 59 True Historc but I saw the new 2018 59 Historics are pretty much the same specs at a lower price, except for it not being double carved. I am not a historic expert by any means but I would like to know the following.

What does the double carving mean and how does this affect the tone / playability?
Would you suggest looking for a TH as opposed to the 2018 historics?

Thank you for any feedback and guidance!
 

Thundermtn

Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2016
Messages
548
Only the most powerful cork sniffery is the difference, tone wise is negligible. I believe it's a final hand shaping of the top. There are a couple other differences but unless you play both to know, you won't. They all are different, play them both and get the best one, but see if you can get close to the '18 price on the TH if the TH is better. Apply poker face with abandon while playing them.
 

markguitar

Les Paul Forum Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2001
Messages
2,375
Hi,

I have been thinking about buying a 59 True Historc but I saw the new 2018 59 Historics are pretty much the same specs at a lower price, except for it not being double carved. I am not a historic expert by any means but I would like to know the following.

What does the double carving mean and how does this affect the tone / playability?
Would you suggest looking for a TH as opposed to the 2018 historics?

Thank you for any feedback and guidance!

The double carve on the TH guitars simply means that the CNC go over the top carve 2 times instead on once and at a slower speed. This leaves less hand sanding to be done but has ZERO effect on tone. The new 2018 top carve is actually more accurate and scanned from the top carve on the original burst "Carmelita". If you want an accurate neck size and carve, the 2018's have that.
 

jam81

New member
Joined
May 20, 2016
Messages
57
The double carve on the TH guitars simply means that the CNC go over the top carve 2 times instead on once and at a slower speed. This leaves less hand sanding to be done but has ZERO effect on tone. The new 2018 top carve is actually more accurate and scanned from the top carve on the original burst "Carmelita". If you want an accurate neck size and carve, the 2018's have that.

Great. Thanks to both. Definitely good information. I live in Chicago and I haven't found someone who has neither but I did find in the Chicago music exchange they have their own run of CME historic Les Paul standard for significantly less money. Any idea if they are worth the try? Has anybody compared them to historic? Ps. I have a 2016 standard HP so I want something close to the vintage Les Paul to complement it.
 
Joined
Jan 5, 2018
Messages
206
The TH will hold more value down the road....they are both great guitars but at the end of the day it's not a TH.....just the production numbers alone make the TH more valuable so go find a used one just my 2 cents :yah
 

Thundermtn

Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2016
Messages
548
Don't pay more for a guitar that doesn't sound as good just because it might be a better investment. Beware the LP that's been for sale for a LONG time. They are instruments above all.
 

Analoga1p

New member
Joined
Sep 29, 2017
Messages
120
Go to the Chicago music exchange try out their CME line go see Matt. Their historics are Carmelita carves...different neck profiles. Only difference is they use a slightly underwound pickup. Try them you won’t be disappointed

Great. Thanks to both. Definitely good information. I live in Chicago and I haven't found someone who has neither but I did find in the Chicago music exchange they have their own run of CME historic Les Paul standard for significantly less money. Any idea if they are worth the try? Has anybody compared them to historic? Ps. I have a 2016 standard HP so I want something close to the vintage Les Paul to complement it.
 

ONEHERO

Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2016
Messages
219
My honest opinion is that the 2018 series have the weird white binding and overly faded colors
the only good thing about the 2018 are the ones with braz boards but that’s over 8-10k

comparing both, the TH has better rolled fingerboard binding, double carved necks that seem to fit better, thin-nitro that was hand-sanded making the guitars more “open”

2018 (59s) go for $5700-5900 whereas used TH are about 5800-6100- personally I prefer the TH way more! The 2018 with the botched binding color and weird faded back colors- not to mention the incomplete burst color are somewhat a step backward :hmm
 

6L6

All Access/Backstage Pass
Joined
Mar 30, 2002
Messages
1,978
The neck shape on the 2018s stand out to me. Also, you can get new ones for way less than $5,700 if you know where to look.
 

tripletime

Les Paul Froum Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
189
The 2018 with the botched binding color and weird faded back colors- not to mention the incomplete burst color are somewhat a step backward :hmm


that's a brutal assessment

I actually find the 2018 to be the most vintage looking
 

jam81

New member
Joined
May 20, 2016
Messages
57
Go to the Chicago music exchange try out their CME line go see Matt. Their historics are Carmelita carves...different neck profiles. Only difference is they use a slightly underwound pickup. Try them you won’t be disappointed
What would an underwound pick-up sound like compared to a regularly wound one?
 

lpthomas

Member
Joined
Mar 12, 2017
Messages
164
My honest opinion is that the 2018 series have the weird white binding and overly faded colors
the only good thing about the 2018 are the ones with braz boards but that’s over 8-10k

comparing both, the TH has better rolled fingerboard binding, double carved necks that seem to fit better, thin-nitro that was hand-sanded making the guitars more “open”

2018 (59s) go for $5700-5900 whereas used TH are about 5800-6100- personally I prefer the TH way more! The 2018 with the botched binding color and weird faded back colors- not to mention the incomplete burst color are somewhat a step backward :hmm

Well, only two of the colors are fades. Royal Tea and Vintage Cherry are not what you describe at all.

Edit: I see, you’re talking back colors as well.

I would give the TH a chance first, simply because they won’t be around very much longer.
 

Tim Plains

Active member
Joined
Aug 1, 2013
Messages
795
What would an underwound pick-up sound like compared to a regularly wound one?
Why don't you just go to CME, play them, and find out for yourself? Seems like people put more faith in their eyes rather than their ears nowadays.

I might be wrong but I believe the CME runs have CME in the serial number. That doesn't concern me any but some people are so anal, they won't buy a regular reissue with a six digit serial number.
 

ntotoro

New member
Joined
Aug 25, 2002
Messages
569
What would an underwound pick-up sound like compared to a regularly wound one?

My own experience, comparing my 2014 R9 (Custombuckers) and 2013 R54 Oxblood (underwound Custombuckers spec'd by Wildwood Guitars), the underwound pickups are a bit brighter and have a hair more clarity. It was enough to hear the difference through the same amp, but difficult to quantify how much was the guitar. That they obviously had a little less push was universal, I'd guess. My Oxblood is a little louder unplugged, but that particular R9 sounds bigger and more balanced unplugged, if that makes sense.

Nick
 

jimmyace2006

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 24, 2007
Messages
2,157
The double carve on the TH guitars simply means that the CNC go over the top carve 2 times instead on once and at a slower speed. This leaves less hand sanding to be done but has ZERO effect on tone. The new 2018 top carve is actually more accurate and scanned from the top carve on the original burst "Carmelita". If you want an accurate neck size and carve, the 2018's have that.

Do you know if there is a difference in the finish / lacquer used on the TH versus a 2018 Historic?
And are the 2018s wet sanded? (Seems like I heard they are not.)
Is the 2018 binding on the neck "rolled"?
 

jam81

New member
Joined
May 20, 2016
Messages
57
Why don't you just go to CME, play them, and find out for yourself? Seems like people put more faith in their eyes rather than their ears nowadays.

I might be wrong but I believe the CME runs have CME in the serial number. That doesn't concern me any but some people are so anal, they won't buy a regular reissue with a six digit serial number.

I will definitely go check them out over the weekend, I don't mind the serial number as I am not planing on buying it for resale but to keep it for a long time.
 
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