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  1. #121

    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by sws1 View Post
    G'Club - $301k


    G'Club - $301k
    Thanks...

    There are more:

    G'CLUB - $406K


    G'CLUB - $302K


    BewarenBewaren

  2. #122

    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by sws1 View Post
    G'Club - $258k


    G'Club - $301k
    I have updated to the correct pricing
    BewarenBewaren

  3. #123
    Les Paul Forum Member fakejake's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by sws1 View Post
    G'Club - $301k
    Gosh!! Now that's my kind of top and burst !!!

  4. #124

    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by fakejake View Post
    Gosh!! Now that's my kind of top and burst !!!
    I think it was nicknamed "Cindy Crawford"

  5. #125
    Les Paul Forum Member sws1's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by mipstoo View Post
    I have updated to the correct pricing
    BewarenBewaren
    They both show the exact same price on my Reverb listing. As of this morning $302k

  6. #126

    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by sws1 View Post
    They both show the exact same price on my Reverb listing. As of this morning $302k
    You're correct

    I tried to post the other two for sale as well, but somehow my posts don't come true

    G'CLUB $406K - 1960 Les Paul

    G'CLUB $258K - 1960 Les Paul

  7. #127
    Les Paul Forum Member sws1's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by mipstoo View Post
    You're correct

    I tried to post the other two for sale as well, but somehow my posts don't come true

    G'CLUB $406K - 1960 Les Paul

    G'CLUB $258K - 1960 Les Paul
    $406k


    $258k

  8. #128

    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by sws1 View Post
    $406k


    $258k
    Thank you
    BewarenBewaren

  9. #129
    Les Paul Forum Member
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Still trying to get a feel as to where the Burst market is for a 1960 mild flame, second half of the year, all original....safe to say that we've easily crossed the $200,000 mark? I'm looking at Reverb, but those are offered prices.

  10. #130
    Les Paul Forum Member Fried okra's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Just curious as to what the general consensus realistically thinks an original clean Burst such as 9 0307 would sell for. Considering it is all original except for the tuning key tips and falls in the same serial number range.

    Last edited by Fried okra; Today at 00:00. Reason: No reason, just felt like making it look like I edited it.



    "I just try to keep my fingers between the binding". Tom Wittrock

    I’m fond of well loved guitars, you know, well played. You can keep all the mint ones, give me one that has bled for its master." - Fried Okra

  11. #131
    Les Paul Forum Member sws1's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by Fried okra View Post
    Just curious as to what the general consensus realistically thinks an original clean Burst such as 9 0307 would sell for. Considering it is all original except for the tuning key tips and falls in the same serial number range.

    One of yours we weren't aware of?

  12. #132
    Les Paul Forum Member Fried okra's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by sws1 View Post
    One of yours we weren't aware of?
    No, but I am looking into one very similar in the same serial range. And want to make a fair offer.
    Last edited by Fried okra; Today at 00:00. Reason: No reason, just felt like making it look like I edited it.



    "I just try to keep my fingers between the binding". Tom Wittrock

    I’m fond of well loved guitars, you know, well played. You can keep all the mint ones, give me one that has bled for its master." - Fried Okra

  13. #133
    Les Paul Forum Member sws1's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by Fried okra View Post
    No, but I am looking into one very similar in the same serial range. And want to make a fair offer.
    I would think that one you posted is certainly north of 300

  14. #134
    Les Paul Forum Member Fried okra's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by sws1 View Post
    I would think that one you posted is certainly north of 300
    My thoughts too, just by seeing asking prices. Just didn’t know if they were actually selling for those prices.
    Last edited by Fried okra; Today at 00:00. Reason: No reason, just felt like making it look like I edited it.



    "I just try to keep my fingers between the binding". Tom Wittrock

    I’m fond of well loved guitars, you know, well played. You can keep all the mint ones, give me one that has bled for its master." - Fried Okra

  15. #135
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by mipstoo View Post
    I think it was nicknamed "Cindy Crawford"
    I love names like this for guitars

  16. #136
    Forum Moderator T.Allen's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Very nice '58 at Rumbleseat.


  17. #137
    Les Paul Forum Member marshall1987's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    The '58 at Rumble Seat has an unusual top color. Don't think I've seen them fade that color before.
    "Scan not a friend under a microscopic glass; you know his faults so let his foibles pass".

    Sir Frank Crisp
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  18. #138
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner Tom Wittrock's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by marshall1987 View Post
    The '58 at Rumble Seat has an unusual top color. Don't think I've seen them fade that color before.
    It's probably the lighting and/or the angle.
    Looks normal to me.
    Pauls to the walls!

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  19. #139
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner Tom Wittrock's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by T.Allen View Post
    Very nice '58 at Rumbleseat.

    What a beauty!


    Bill of sale from November 1962 .... .
    Pauls to the walls!

    Hüter der Flammen!

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  20. #140
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner and Moderator CDaughtry's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    How about the "Sexy Hexy" burst?

    http://www.mylespaul.com/threads/the...lantis.412620/


    I wasn't sure whether to put it in the "Bursts for sale" or "Goldtops for sale" thread?

    Apparently, it's a burst now. Wasn't its current owner arguing vociferously that it was a Goldtop back in the "2 bursts in Germany" thread?

  21. #141
    Les Paul Forum Member MapleFlame's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Poor girl has been through hell
    Top carves are sexy

  22. #142
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner Tom Wittrock's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post

    Apparently, it's a burst now. Wasn't its current owner arguing vociferously that it was a Goldtop back in the "2 bursts in Germany" thread?
    Yes, as was pointed out recently in the older thread.
    Was this just a ruse to get the guitar cheap?
    1) Expert claims it isn't really a refin Burst, but instead a refin Goldtop. In doing so, a reputable dealer is raked over the coals for saying it was a refin Burst..
    2) Expert buys/deals for it based on his expertise.
    3) Expert resells it as a Burst.

    This whole episode smells fishy.
    Pauls to the walls!

    Hüter der Flammen!

    PLEASE SUPPORT www.burstserial.com !!
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  23. #143
    Les Paul Forum Member sws1's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wittrock View Post
    Yes, as was pointed out recently in the older thread.
    Was this just a ruse to get the guitar cheap?
    1) Expert claims it isn't really a refin Burst, but instead a refin Goldtop. In doing so, a reputable dealer is raked over the coals for saying it was a refin Burst..
    2) Expert buys/deals for it based on his expertise.
    3) Expert resells it as a Burst.

    This whole episode smells fishy.
    Maybe it’s really a lapsteel...per the ledger. 😉

    I thought all the 58-60 ledgers were missing, or is it just some of them?

  24. #144
    Les Paul Forum Member
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wittrock View Post
    Yes, as was pointed out recently in the older thread.
    Was this just a ruse to get the guitar cheap?
    1) Expert claims it isn't really a refin Burst, but instead a refin Goldtop. In doing so, a reputable dealeris raked over the coals for saying it was a refin Burst..
    2) Expert buys/deals for it based on his expertise.
    3) Expert resells it as a Burst.

    This whole episode smells fishy.



    Detlef? Reputable?

    Oh how we laughed. Sales of fake Marshall and authentication of fake Explorer just get lost in the long grass, again.....because Detlef is Tom's friend.

    What a fucking joke.
    The artist formerly known as "A-hole".



  25. #145
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner and Moderator CDaughtry's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    John...we know your opinion on Detlef. What’s your opinion of this guitar now bring marketed as a burst when Eric insisted it was a Goldtop? Does that offend your notion of full disclosure?

  26. #146
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    John...we know your opinion on Detlef. What’s your opinion of this guitar now bring marketed as a burst when Eric insisted it was a Goldtop? Does that offend your notion of full disclosure?
    Charlie, as I stated ad nauseum (SWIDT) in the original thread.....I just don't know. I haven't seen the guitar, and in all probability I wouldn't be able to tell whether it's a GT or a 'burst.

    Besides, it's not the absence of "full disclosure" that offends me, it's the blind hypocrisy.

    Let's not pretend this is about "full disclosure". It's about old enmities coming to the surface again and people taking the opportunity to "take a shot" on any premise. Duke it out, it's all good. Eric's a big boy, he can fend for himself......but don't expect Tom not to be called out on the "blind spot" he has for his friend's, what shall we call them, "indiscretions".
    The artist formerly known as "A-hole".



  27. #147
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner and Moderator CDaughtry's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    This morning, Eric texted me and asked me "Charlie...what would you like me to disclose?"

    Here's my answer:

    Many consider Eric's opinion, on all things vintage, to be the gospel. In the Detlef bashing thread, despite many suggesting that this could have very well been a burst, Eric vehemently insisted it was a Goldtop. In that thread, it served his purposes, for the sake of the Detlef bashing, to say it was a Goldtop, because that made Detlef's "misrepresentations" to the kid more egregious.

    Now...when Eric lists it for sale, he says "This might be the first opportunity some of you fellow guitar geeks might get at owning an elusive Burst. Since it is a refin., it will be less than half of the typical $250k+ entry fee!!!"

    I take that to mean that it can be bought in the 100k to 125k range. That's mint Goldtop money, not a realistic price for a Goldtop that has been refinished 6 times.

    To specifically answer his question of "What would you like me to disclose?" My answer is, advertise it as a refinned Goldtop (which was his adamant opinion). He could then say, "But I could be wrong, and if I am, and it started out as a burst, you're getting a good deal!"


    Weren't we all demanding full and complete disclosure in the Detlef thread? Should the same not apply to Eric?

  28. #148
    Les Paul Forum Member jimmi's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    John...we know your opinion on Detlef. What’s your opinion of this guitar now bring marketed as a burst when Eric insisted it was a Goldtop? Does that offend your notion of full disclosure?
    I just read the thread....seems he is pretty open about the history of the guitar including it being a suspected GT....admits that the ledgers have that serial number on a lap guitar meaning it may not be the real one. It has being called the "Conti Burst" for a while so in advertising it, seems he is just going with what people will recognize.

    where is the problem (aside from Tom trying to settle a score and start a fight).?

    From that thread " Prior to the last refinishing job by Kim, the guitar was noticed to have walnut pore filler in the mahogany.........So the guitar was thought to most likely be have originally been a Goldtop since the serial number is too low for a Burst"
    Last edited by jimmi; 06-25-18 at 08:39 AM.

  29. #149
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    .....the Detlef bashing thread.......
    Charlie, honest response, do you think Detlef deserves "bashing" for:

    1. selling an obviously fake "vintage" Marshall as being all original; and
    2. "authenticating" a fake Explorer for one of his cabal, when he so clearly lacks the expertise to do so.

    What you perjoritively describe as a "bashing" others would describe as a long overdue call-to-account.

    Don't conflate Detlef's actions with Eric's. Address them separately by all means, but they are not one and the same.

    Point me to where Eric has sold a fake and I'll concede the point.
    The artist formerly known as "A-hole".



  30. #150
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner and Moderator CDaughtry's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Yes...I agree that anyone who is less than 100% honest in vintage deals should be called out. But it's curious how you are so black and white in the one instance, i.e. Detlef, and so gray in this one. I know Eric is your friend, and I know you've had nothing but good dealings with him, but shouldn't we all be striving for as close to 100% full disclosure as possible?

  31. #151
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by Garincha View Post
    He should edit his own post in the other forum then. This is what he posted:
    Originally Posted by Eric Ernest
    1. Original Goldtop.
    2. Early 70's sunburst refin.
    3. Early 80's Gibson factory (clown) sunburst refin around 1980 when it was renecked by the Kalamazoo factory with an NOS neck. (Work order done through Gruhn's.)
    4. Early 2000's German sunburst done by one of Detlef's guys.
    5. 2015 Swiss sunburst done by one of Gregory's guys.
    6. 2017 a sunburst Historic Makeover refin.
    On 2/1/18 Eric stated the above but by 2/7/18 he was questioning if it was a goldtop -

    1. Original Goldtop?
    2. Early 70's sunburst refin. Stupid burst pattern.
    3. Late 70's Gibson factory (clown) sunburst refin around 1980 when it was renecked by the Kalamazoo factory with an NOS neck. (Work order done through Gruhn's.)
    4. Early 2000's sunburst done by Mathias Schindehütte.
    5. 2015 Mathias Schindehütte again at Gregory's request. (Very murky finish.)
    6. 2017 a sunburst Historic Makeover refin. (Not painted as requested on work order. Walnut pore filler! WTF?)

  32. #152
    Les Paul Forum Member jimmi's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    Yes...I agree that anyone who is less than 100% honest in vintage deals should be called out. But it's curious how you are so black and white in the one instance, i.e. Detlef, and so gray in this one. I know Eric is your friend, and I know you've had nothing but good dealings with him, but shouldn't we all be striving for as close to 100% full disclosure as possible?

    I just quoted the thread in question where he states the guitar is suspected to be a possible refin GT. It has a celebrity connection which probably explains the price (Keith Urban sold his water logged '58 GT for around 100k for example).

  33. #153
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner Tom Wittrock's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by F-Hole View Post
    Charlie, honest response, do you think Detlef deserves "bashing" for:

    1. selling an obviously fake "vintage" Marshall as being all original; and
    2. "authenticating" a fake Explorer for one of his cabal, when he so clearly lacks the expertise to do so.
    He did not sell the Marshall. That's a lie continued by you and others.
    And, there is no "cabal" as you say.

    Now who's being dishonest?
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  34. #154
    Les Paul Forum Member jimmi's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wittrock View Post
    He did not sell the Marshall. That's a lie continued by you and others.
    And, there is no "cabal" as you say.

    Now who's being dishonest?
    My recollection was that the Marshall was part of the deal sold with the Conti guitar. Doesnt mater if it was a consignment. Then there is the issue of the explorer...

  35. #155
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Wittrock View Post
    He did not sell the Marshall. That's a lie continued by you and others.
    And, there is no "cabal" as you say.

    Now who's being dishonest?
    Well, given you ask, it's you being dishonest Tom.

    Detlef (GuitarPoint) issued a receipt for the Marshall sale, a copy of which has been posted to this site.

    Next you'll be telling us that Detlef routinely issues receipts to customers for the sale of gear he doesn't own and hasn't sold.

    Get real.
    The artist formerly known as "A-hole".



  36. #156
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    But it's curious how you are so black and white in the one instance, i.e. Detlef, and so gray in this one.
    I don't agree with your premise.

    Go back to the original thread and re-read what I wrote. I stated that I don't know whether it's a GT or a 'burst. Said the same in this thread. What I did say is that having seen the "Marshall", for which Detlef provided a receipt, and the "authentication" of the fake Explorer, Detlef doesn't get the benefit of the doubt. The same would be true of any dealer. What particularly grates with Detlef is the BS on his website about people looking to acquire vintage pieces are safe with GuitarPoint because they have the expertise necessary to ensure they do not buy fakes. It's a masterpiece of post-satirical double-think.

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    I know Eric is your friend, and I know you've had nothing but good dealings with him, but shouldn't we all be striving for as close to 100% full disclosure as possible?
    Again, you're conflating two separate issues.

    Eric and I are friendly, but not friends. We simply don't know each other well enough to be "friends". That's not intended to be disparaging, I have very few real friends, but I'm friendly with a lot of people, Eric included.

    In answer, yes, we should be striving for as close to 100% disclosure as possible.
    The artist formerly known as "A-hole".



  37. #157
    Les Paul Forum Co-Owner and Moderator CDaughtry's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by F-Hole View Post
    I don't agree with your premise.

    Go back to the original thread and re-read what I wrote. I stated that I don't know whether it's a GT or a 'burst. Said the same in this thread.
    I think that misses the point. It doesn't matter whether you think its a Goldtop or a burst, it matters what Eric thinks it is, and he pretty decisively thought it was a Goldtop in the other thread.


    However, I will say this...if we were back in school and choosing sides on the debate team, I'd want you on my team. ;)

  38. #158
    Les Paul Forum Member jimmi's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    I think that misses the point. It doesn't matter whether you think its a Goldtop or a burst, it matters what Eric thinks it is, and he pretty decisively thought it was a Goldtop in the other thread.


    However, I will say this...if we were back in school and choosing sides on the debate team, I'd want you on my team. ;)
    There is more evidence now than when we discussed the guitar in that thread. We now see the serial number was recorded to a different instrument in the ledger (information provided by Eric I might add) which suggests it is not the real serial number to the guitar. Two peices of information raising the possibility of a refinished GT were an early number and brown filler. Neither were mentioned with the previous sale (along with unclear discrptions of replaced plastics) or maybe not even noticed. Both are discussed in Eric's thread along with the possible implications and possible explainations. Tell me, is there a real equivalence between the level of disclosure here?

    I will wait until you respond to Marlow since you appear to be ignoring me.

  39. #159
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Quote Originally Posted by CDaughtry View Post
    It doesn't matter whether you think its a Goldtop or a burst, it matters what Eric thinks it is, and he pretty decisively thought it was a Goldtop in the other thread.
    I didn't take away that Eric was difinitive in his opinion.

    I undersood him to have thought it was "very probably" a refinished GT.

    As for "disclosure", you'd be hard pressed to find a guitar that's had more of its characteristics disclosed so publicly in such a short time.
    The artist formerly known as "A-hole".



  40. #160
    Les Paul Forum Member jimmi's Avatar
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    Re: Current bursts for sale...

    Ironically, in an attempt to get at Eric, bringing this up in this manner only hurts GP as most that knew about this had forgotten. Now the issues with the Marshall and the Explorer are freshly discussed.

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