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True Historic ´59 Bavarian Makeover

majorminor

Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2017
Messages
96
I'm amazed at the lengths we all go to get where we want.
Gibson is just trying to keep up with our desires, but always seems to make a mess of it--as a company.

There IS another aspect to this - and it is one where Gibson need take no blame whatsoever - but it is, nevertheless, a very potent force that we all deal with.
In fact, it could be that rather than blame Gibson for the constant striving for better collectable instruments, we should, in fact, be blaming ourselves.


Yes - us. The very people who view this site.


Because, as well as musicians, we are also collectors.


Now, if there is one thing that has changed the hobby of collecting - whatever the object of the obsession (and it IS an obsession) happens to be, then that thing is the Internet.


20/30 years ago, you could be a collector - stamps, model trains, butterflies, whatever - and you almost existed in a vacuum. If you were lucky, you might have a local club where you could meet a few other obsessives, but otherwise, your collection would be pretty well a private thing, for you alone.


But all that has now changed - the Internet means that, no matter how obscure your obsession might be, you can connect as often as you wish with practically every other like minded obsessive in the world - via a forum site like this.



Let me elaborate. As well as being a "Gibsonhead", I also collect "Workwear".


"Work what?", I hear you say......


Here's what it is. There are guys out there who love the clothes worn by say, 1930's/40's American working folk. Leather, Denim, Shirts, Jackets, Jeans, Overalls - all are avidly collected.
There are still original pieces to be had, now at huge prices - folks constantly scour ebay and other sites, along with charity shops, looking far a "find". Modern repos are now produced, and the market has largely been cornered by the Japanese, although US companies are fighting back - even pricing the stuff at the same eye-watering prices as the Japs.


Jap produced books about the best original clothes sell out as soon as they appear - even though they are in Japanese - the pics are so good.


US Army Air Force WW2 Leather Jackets are particularly prized. The originals were cheaply churned out in their 100s during the war, but now, folks will pay upwards of $2500 for a stitch-for-stitch repro, and wait 2 years for it to be made.

Notice the similarities in the hobby? Completely different products - but exactly the same passion.


Why? Very simple - as soon as you acquire the latest, very best bit of kit - you can take a pic of it, and post it on the Forum site of your choice, knowing full well that your post will be followed by lots of "Excellent", "Good score", and so on.....

Instead of "Play it in good health", you get "Wear it in good health". Instead of "Burst Porn", we get "Type 2 Porn" (that's a Denim jacket made by Levis from the 30's until 1963), or "A2 Porn" (the flying jackets I mentioned....)

Guys will pay $900 for a pair of jeans, that to you would look like any other pair of jeans, but he knows that the "details" are SO much better....

I have a room full of stuff - probably 40 or 50 Jackets, too many shirts to count, dozens of pairs of Jeans, and I can tell you why each and every one is special, but folks down at my local alehouse just think I wear casual gear.

There is even a guy in Austria called Florian who makes fabulous 19th Century shirts and jackets! Surely not the same guy?! :nut

Does all this sound a little familiar?

Well, it is all just what guys do. We have hobbies. But those hobbies are SO much more intense with the advent of the Web. The whole thing is fuelled by the web.
Even Joe B posts videos of his collection.

And the first thing we do with a makeover is post it one the Forum (I'm not knocking that - I'd do just the same).:)


So, maybe Gibson is just filling a need that WE demonstrate. Just like the guy who hand-makes the best Leather Flying Jackets in the world.....


No one to blame but ourselves......:rofl
 
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Pellman73

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 9, 2016
Messages
1,762
Majorminor--

Is it part of the "workwear" collecting culture to still call Japanese people Japs? Pretty sure that's not all that cool if you are at least the one Japanese person reading this thread.

and renderit I'm bidding on your vintage hand stitched lederhosen tidy whities
 

majorminor

Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2017
Messages
96
Majorminor--

Is it part of the "workwear" collecting culture to still call Japanese people Japs? Pretty sure that's not all that cool if you are at least the one Japanese person reading this thread.

If you find that offensive, then I apologise. No offence was intended.

It is surely just a shortening of the word - if you called me a "brit", I would not be offended, but maybe I look less for offence.

If you called an Australian an "ozzy" is that so bad? They refer to their homeland as Oz, after all.

I have a German friend on a forum who uses the name "kraut" as his forum name - I guess he is being offensive to himself......

Whatever....:hmm
 

J.D.

Well-known member
Joined
May 24, 2006
Messages
10,030
help help I'm being offended. :rofl

If people only spent their money on stuff they needed, their wouldn't be much of an economy.

For this thread, fortunately I'm very happy with relatively inexpensive guitars. I personally couldn't imagine dismantling a new True Historic (purchased at any price) as the assembly and finish, as flawed as it apparently is, has value. But if that is what makes the OP happy, more power to him. Live and let live.
 

Orreman

New member
Joined
Jun 20, 2015
Messages
147
Today Florian started with the top carve.
Can't wait to see the finished result!:rofl

XX0bu5x.jpg


ds81SeW.jpg


N3A3oXj.jpg


guraTTJ.jpg


jlYk85v.jpg
 

El Gringo

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 8, 2015
Messages
5,657
messing with the top carve after it has come from Gibson Custom will this not affect TONE ?
 

Orreman

New member
Joined
Jun 20, 2015
Messages
147
messing with the top carve after it has come from Gibson Custom will this not affect TONE ?
It might change the tone a bit. It is CNC Carved at the factory, so a little hand carving might change it a bit to the better.
First and foremost, it will make the top carve look like an original '59.
 
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DoubleBoogie

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Joined
Jun 6, 2004
Messages
4,800
I'm no expert luthier (or even a decent hack) or claim to fully know what I'm talking about sometimes, but Gibson's process of gluing the fretboard to the neck before gluing the neck to the body always struck me as kind of a 'cart before the horse sort of thing'.

It just seems to me that you would want to ensure that the tenon is firmly seated in the pocket and the maple top and top of the tenon are sanded nice and flush with each other before gluing the fretboard onto the neck.

From what I am seeing in these photos, I've got to wonder if down the line, the fretbord isn't going to eventually ramp up in the neck joint area.

As soon as I saw that gap, I had to instantly wonder if this is where those dreaded "dead" spots on the fingerboard come from that you occasionally experience with guitars? :hmm

A cool thread though and that is going to be one really gorgeous guitar when its all done. Here's to your guitar turning out to be everything you hope it will be Orreman! :salude
 

majorminor

Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2017
Messages
96
When I saw "New correct top carve. The TH carve is much flatter than a real 59", in the original post, I thought "So how will he do that? How can you add wood that is not there?"

It looks now like all he is doing is making the outer surfaces flatter in order to emphasize the hump in the middle.

Is that it?

Looking at my 2004 CR4, it already has those flat areas :hmm
 

asapmaz

Active member
Joined
Jun 19, 2003
Messages
302
When I saw "New correct top carve. The TH carve is much flatter than a real 59", in the original post, I thought "So how will he do that? How can you add wood that is not there?"

It looks now like all he is doing is making the outer surfaces flatter in order to emphasize the hump in the middle.

Is that it?

Looking at my 2004 CR4, it already has those flat areas :hmm

That's what HM does, too.
 

rockabilly69

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 29, 2001
Messages
2,872
A cool thread though and that is going to be one really gorgeous guitar when its all done. Here's to your guitar turning out to be everything you hope it will be Orreman! :salude
+1000, if I had the cash I would like a Gibson guitar that has had the hands of a master craftsman fine tuning it to get it as close to 50's specs as possible. I don't have that kind of cash, so I live vicariously through those who do, and I love to follow these Bavarian and HM makeover threads.
 

marshall1987

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2005
Messages
3,278
Majorminor--

Is it part of the "workwear" collecting culture to still call Japanese people Japs? Pretty sure that's not all that cool if you are at least the one Japanese person reading this thread.

and renderit I'm bidding on your vintage hand stitched lederhosen tidy whities

PC speech police coming to your front door. :hmm
 

zacknorton

Active member
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
731
"You'd need to remove a shit-ton more wood than what a "normal" reshape would remove in order to have any sonic difference.

Making the neck pocket and fingerboard to neck joints tighter and with different flies should make an easily noticed difference.
 

J.D.

Well-known member
Joined
May 24, 2006
Messages
10,030
He's scraping in a slight "dish" around the edge, a miniscule amount of wood. AVH correct feature of most vintage top carves.
 

majorminor

Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2017
Messages
96
PC speech police coming to your front door. :hmm

Why is it that some folk never read the original text before chiming in with a comment on a comment by someone else?

Come on then, wise guy - show me where I referred to Japanese people as Japs? :eek:la
 

Tarcisioo

Member
Joined
Oct 5, 2014
Messages
385
Damn, sanding a couple of millimeters from the flat part of the top affects tone? There's a lot of folks trying to bash this thread from the start, but now it's getting ridiculous

Good luck and may this guitar be that one!
 
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