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Interesting PAF related facts from Jim Wagner

Tonefiend

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Jul 15, 2001
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Experiment with different materials, alloys, magnets, wire, patterns, tensions.. All within the realm of what they did back then. Learn what they contribute to the sound and how they react in various guitars. Then from that knowledge experiment, learn your craft. Learn how they react in different guitars and wind from that perspective. Copying a PAF talk is all hype because they are all over the place and react differently in different guitars.

Copying for the sake of copying is a fools game. These guys who are analyzing the various metals and trying to replicate what they used are only providing data for one small piece of the puzzle.
 

Dave P

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Oct 13, 2001
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I will preface this by saying I am on Jim's artist page. Jim makes great sounding pickups, I still use them and enjoy them. That's not to say I don't use pickups made by others as well, and I like those also. I've also wound quite a few of my own pickups, learned a lot about what makes them tick. I'm not a real big fan of manufacturers disparaging their competitors to make themselves look better, especially in such a subjective area like tone. Sometimes with all this boutique stuff, a person ends up chasing their own tail trying out this, that, and the next big thing. I know, I've been there. There's been a lot of records made by guys who have gotten great tones by using run of the mill Duncans and Dimarzios. I've known some fantastic players that use very ordinary gear and have gotten amazing results.
 

corpse

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Jun 9, 2007
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It takes a fire in the belly, and fanatical belief system to do what these pickup guys do. Most of them aren'ty typing these emails from their corporate jst, if ya follow. If they sound like they are making the cool aid, they have to.
I am a huge believer that RoHS has alot to do with modern tone.
 

duaneflowers

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Aug 13, 2013
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2,522
What were the interesting tidbits..

I found the list of inconsistencies particularly interesting. I had known of a few of them, but not all of them. I've known several winders who have gone inside original PAFs and encountered all manner of irregularity, so Jim's outline provides some detail/confirmation of some of these variances (and I'm sure there are others).

I like the set of Wagners I have and my intention here was not really to discuss the pros and cons of Wagner pickups. He is a respected winder who's been at it for awhile and I just thought his perspective on original PAFs rather revealing.

Some winders would have you believe that guitars are nothing more than fancy holders for their pickups. :eek:la Quite a few folks leave their fiddles stock and say pickups don't really matter 'tall... its the construction and natural resonance of the guitar that counts. Amp builders tend to push the notion that the magic is in the circuitry. "Tubists" believe only NOS Glass can cultivate that mystical mojo destined for our mythology. Some preach that its all in the fingers and great guitarists can make a rubber band play Mozart. Others say it is a combination of all of the above.

And still others just point at us and laugh while mumbling under their breath about how sick and twisted we all are... and since history is written by the victors, someday they will undoubtedly be proven correct. :spabout
 

mistersnappy

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Jan 20, 2006
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7,321
What I don't understand, though I completely *get* why its done, is why guitarists and pickup winders in many cases try to emulate tones that are a result of mic placement, amps and recording engineer decisions.
 
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Big Al

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Apr 24, 2002
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14,537
I've used Jim's pickups and they are great for me. As good or better than anything out there. In my case they are just wonderful and have always produced stellar tone that I like.
 

garywright

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Aug 17, 2002
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15,583
cool thread ..I have an interest growing in Jim’s pickups mainly sparked by Scumbacks recent recommendation...at the moment I’ve got a pair of A4s on the way to try in my A5 equipped Wizz set ..we’ll see what happens
 

TM1

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Jun 27, 2003
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I'd like to know where the Myth of Gibson using "Reject Magnets" came from. I know they bought magnets in bulk from 4 or 5 different companies(Jon can clear that up..). But in my thinking, a "reject" magnet would be one that doesn't hold a charge. I have probably 30 magnets that came from `50's Gibson pickups and they all work just fine. I have a "magnetometer" and can check the gauss of any magnet. It's not a cheap one either. Every 60+ year old magnet I've checked is pretty good, so it's a bit puzzling to me as the validity of his remarks..Most of the magnet manufactures from back then still will pour magnets today based on those original specs they've kept in their files for a few decades now..
So Dave, what's the basis of your statement?
Thanks!
 

goldtop0

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Aug 19, 2003
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8,931
What I don't understand, though I completely *get* why its done, is why guitarists and pickup winders in many cases try to emulate tones that are a result of mic placement, amps and recording engineer decisions.

And I'll add.........speakers/cabs........studio/room etc.

A couple of 'raw' recordings I've followed over the years are from early '66 ........ Lonely Years and Bernard Jenkins........to me the difference in tone, sound and nuance are in these two tracks.
The fact that EC was in his ascent at this time is well known as his playing is exemplary.
It's the player generally and not necessarily the equipment that provides the magic.........but there's always the perfect storm, and that's what I love about these two great tunes.
 
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