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Upgrade Plastics Comparision Thread

Godot

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Feb 6, 2007
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So, I no have an LP - but I recently changed the plastic stuff on my Howard Roberts Fusion from black to cream. Or creme. Whateves.

But I read this thread, pertaining to the whiteness of the whiteness of the current plastics available. And made my plan to get some replacement parts.

Ended up using some spare mounting rings from Allparts I had around the house and a pickguard made from a template of the original by Pickguardian.
 
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Godot

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Feb 6, 2007
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The Allparts rings and Pickguardian guard installed. Gibson Historic Ring for comparison. I figured I'd go a little more parchment and a little less G.I. Joe. It's not a Replica of any kind , it's a modern HRF, so what do I care about accuracy? Just looks better.

IMG_4945.jpg




Plastics02.jpg
 

Buzz

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Super built up on the inside of the ring can be used, either many coats of thin, or else use med. or heavy, if heavy or gel is used make sure some gets into the crack. Excelorator helps just about every application of CA, and it can be found in hobby stores or luthier supply stores. Scrape off excess with single edge razor, if any gets on the outside of the ring first scrape flush than use fine grades of sandpaper (800 or higher) wet, use Micromesh for the most invisible repair.

I've had Fatboy's on an '04 and an '07 for about 6 months and they show no signs of spliting, I think this only happens when they put on those that have a less flat deck.

Evan Gibson rings will split if you put Historic spec. on an earlier reissue that has a rounded deck, this happened to me with an '88 reissue.
 
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DANELECTRO

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Feb 24, 2003
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Why Fatboy Rings Crack (and always in the same place)

Fatboy rings crack due to a weak knit line that is formed in the part due to poor placement of the gate in the injection mold. The gate is the point were the plastic enters the mold cavity. Whenever plastic flowing into a mold hits an obstical that causes it to split off into two directions, a knit line is formed where the plastic joints back together. The knit line is inherently weaker because the plastic leading the flow is already beginning to cool so it doesn't fuse together well. If you look very closely at your rings, you can see the knit line which appears to be a very faint scratch in the part.

This photo compares the gate and knit lines positions on both a Fatboy and a Historic neck postion pickup ring. Notice that the knit line always occurs directly opposite of the gate. The Fatboy ring is gated in the center of the neck side of the ring, so the knit line occurs in the center of the bridge side of the ring. The center area is where the most stress occurs due to bending, and thus, a crack occurs.
FatboyKnitLines1a-1.jpg


The Bridge position ring is gated in two places, so there are actually two knit lines that occur on this part.
FatboyKnitLines1b-1.jpg


The problem could be cured by modifying the mold to move the gate position to the end of the parts as was done on the Historic parts.

Of the five sets of Fatboys I have installed, two pairs have cracked so far. I had success repairing them by gluing a patch of fine fiberglass mesh onto the inside surface of the center area of the ring. I'll pull one of the rings and take a photo when I get a chance.
 

DANELECTRO

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Another place you will find knit lines on your Historic is on the knobs. The gate postion is on the underside of the knob between the "0" and the "10". Plastic flows around the center post and rejoins on the opposite side. If you look at the top of the knob, you can see the knit line which appears as a fine scratch running from the center post towards the numeral "5".
 

Buzz

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Dano, you've just given me an idea: instead of waiting for them to break and than repairing them, which is never as good and will show, how about running thin superglue around that inner ledge BEFORE they break to add strenghth? Why havn't I thought of this before? Maybe this will end up being credited to somebody else I should lay claims to it now soooo...

I'ts officially claimed "The BUZZ MOD FOR FATBOY RINGS"

I'll be doing this next time I'm able to, until than I'll just losen up the screws a bit so there is less flex on them.

Good luck trying to get Fatboy to change the manufacturing process, I don't know if he's got that much control over them or is able to have the improvements made. So far, the only one I ruined is one that I put tried to bend heating it up with a heat gun after immersion in a big pan of very hot water didn't make them bend at all. I had successfully sanded a bit more radius on the bottoms of one set but it's real easy to make mistakes that way too.

Make sure the ring is free of any grease goo or films, clean them off with naptha, than a few drops of accelorator on the rings, pat off the excess you don't too much or it will chase the glue into puddles and or foam-up. Than a few drops of thin letting it run around the inner edge. Not so much it will run over and bond your fingers to the ring.
It's really better to use only very light amounts of accelorator and allow them to have a few hours to dry for hours between layers. They would only need about 1/32" of build-up and this would not show from the outside.

What might evan be better would be to screw them down on to a piece of wood with the same radius as the deck of the guitar, and than with it up-side down let the glue puddle in the arch. This way they are in the correct bent position and the glue is bonded while they are in the right position.
 

DANELECTRO

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I agree with you 100% about reinforcing the rings BEFORE they crack, however I really doubt that the glue itself will help much. Adding a patch of the fiberglass mesh will add much more strength than the glue alone will. You can find the mesh at any hobby store that deals in RC airplanes. It's typically used for reinforcing two wing sections that are being glued together. Here's how I go about making the patch:

1. Cut a patch about 1/2" long and as wide as the inside width of the ring.
2. Put a drop or two of superglue on the inside surface of the ring. Even it out with a toothpick.
3. Using tweezers, place the patch on the inside of the ring. Press it into place with a toothpick.
4. Once the glue is dry, sand any of the patch that is overhanging the bottom edge.

FatboyRings003.jpg

FatboyRings006.jpg

FatboyRings009.jpg
 

Buzz

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Hum, seems like a good idea to use the patch, I'll pick up a piece of that soon to have handy.

I think adding powder of a sanded ring that was broken would help too. As with using wood dust, it mixes with thin superglue. I've found that putting on the glue first than adding a pinch of the powder works better than adding glue over the powder. In this case as all accelorator is needed in the right amounts, in this case after the application of thin CA and plastic powder.
 

corpse

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Jun 9, 2007
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Better than plastic powder is baking powder (not soda). It will cause the glue to set immediately, but it will make a substance that has the mechanical strength of dried epoxy resin- it also sands and shapes well. Very hard and very tough. FWIW.
 

corpse

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My new experiment-
In the absense of Fatboy- and I won't spend $85 on plastic rings- i bought a couple sets of Dimarzios white rings. The appear dimensionally identical to the rings on my Historic.
I sanded them a bit to take off the real "plastic' look with some fine emory cloth- i left a few glossy spots- and then have been leaving them outdoors on a window ledge, and then under a flourescent lamp at nights. I think they have discolored a bit alteady- probably wishful thinking. If after a couple of weeks there is not noticable discoloration I will take a more active approach and try a wash of oil paint. I really like the color of Grecos rings on his project guitar, and that is my goal. Since Mark Foley won't sell any of his sets, I am forced to try this. For $10 a set WTH.
Anybody know where to get a Buzzy pickguard?
Jim
 

MarketMaster

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Jul 16, 2008
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I heard somewhere that the Fatboy and Vintage Clone stuff was being reworked and the owner of the company was taking a new direction with the way everything is being sold. I tried to get a stop tail piece the other day and couldn't. I hope they rectify their issues and get all their parts back out on the market!!!!
 

BIG Dave

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Aug 18, 2001
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My new experiment-
In the absense of Fatboy- and I won't spend $85 on plastic rings-


RS Guitars normally sells the Vintage Clone pickup rings for $119.95. They just had a 20% OFF sale making them $95.96. I ordered a pair and they are scheduled to arrive tomorrow. I know they are over $85 but sometimes you just have to splurge! For what we pay for R9's, PAF's, vintage amps, NOS Mullard tubes, even effect pedals, I felt $96 wasn't too bad.
 

Classic

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Dec 6, 2004
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Left to Right in each photo -USA, Fatboy Re-vibe, RS Guitarworks

KIF_5676.jpg


KIF_5679.jpg


KIF_5680.jpg


I find the RS top hats to be too cloudy for my liking.
 

corpse

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Jun 9, 2007
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These are some Dimarzio rings I aged to the Danelectro family recipie
lamp007.jpg
 

buyusfear

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Oct 3, 2006
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DiMarzio rings were aged with everything, coffee, tea, (left in a bath for over 2 months) ultimatley brown kiwi shoe polish was all that worked, but would rub off after a couple hours of playing, returning the rings to their white color.

Rings.jpg


Rings2.jpg
 
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