• Guys, we've spent considerable money converting the Les Paul Forum to this new XenForo platform, and we have ongoing monthly operating expenses. THE "DONATIONS" TAB IS NOW WORKING, AND WE WOULD APPRECIATE ANY DONATIONS YOU CAN MAKE TO KEEP THE LES PAUL FORUM GOING! Thank you!

NVAD 1960 Fender Super Amp

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
The Super arrived yesterday- the date code on the tag is JL which is Dec 1960. It is in very nice shape. The color is mocha not the cocoa brown and except for a burn on the top near the handle the tolex is really good- there is a knot shadow nearby as well.
IMG_1883_zpsgo080jqf.jpg

For comparison my 62 VL.
IMG_1884_zpsukufywxy.jpg
[/URL][/IMG]
The Jensens have been reconed- last week in fact, as one of them was giving off a rattly death knell. The tubes are Ruby 5881- and there are a ton of 12AX7's (six to be exact). The clean tone is wonderful- I spent more than half my play time last night on the neck pick up of my '18 59. I think the 6G4 is very similar to the VL- it has that "swallowed" sound. I run it through a Tone Preserver dropping the voltage to 117V- these things predate UL so there is no comment about voltage or wattage on the back. Of primary note is the "harmonic" Vibrato- quite different from the VL or the Deluxe. With the speed and the rate at about 2/3 it is really similar to a leslie.
I need some more time with it to get some range ideas; I haven't even plugged into the Normal channel yet.
Wally or Sonar- the Presence knob does something- brightens the tone I want to say- but what is it actually doing? No where near as dramatic as a Marshall- but like the '63 Bassman I used to own- it's not that big of a deal- or is some cap out of spec?
 
Last edited:

sonar

New member
Joined
Jan 10, 2003
Messages
3,589
GREAT amp! Maybe my favorite of the Brownies.

The tremolo on the Super is very dynamic and when healthy the amp has an outstanding overdrive. A little more front-forward in attack compared to a Tweed with great mids and as you mentioned the clean is to die for.

The presence control is a high frequency boost that effects the power amp, unlike the tone controls that dampen the preamp. You'll get a little more upper mids to treble when playing clean, but it's not that overly drastic. When pushing the amp hard the Presence should really help shape your overdrive tone. It's kind of hard to describe, but for example when playing my old Marshall the only knob I fiddle with is the presence knob as that has a heavy influence on my ears when pushing the amp - going from somewhat "linear" to a more jagged overdrive.

Anyway, congrats! That's an awesome amp and I'm officially jealous.
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
GREAT amp! Maybe my favorite of the Brownies.

That's an awesome amp and I'm officially jealous.
And that's really why we buy them isn't it?
I have to mess with the presence more when overdriving it.
 

LeonC

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2002
Messages
799
Love the 6G4-A Super! The harmonic tremolo always reminds me of a Univibe...errr...maybe I said that backwards :); It's the swampiest sounding "tremolo" around. Anyway, congrats and enjoy!
 

agogetr

Active member
Joined
Jan 22, 2019
Messages
451
love seein those knots. especially on mint tweeds. then you have a pretty good idea its the real deal! the super is one of my faves they really crack when you turnem up
The Super arrived yesterday- the date code on the tag is JL which is Dec 1960. It is in very nice shape. The color is mocha not the cocoa brown and except for a burn on the top near the handle the tolex is really good- there is a knot shadow nearby as well.
IMG_1883_zpsgo080jqf.jpg

For comparison my 62 VL.
IMG_1884_zpsukufywxy.jpg
[/URL][/IMG]
The Jensens have been reconed- last week in fact, as one of them was giving off a rattly death knell. The tubes are Ruby 5881- and there are a ton of 12AX7's (six to be exact). The clean tone is wonderful- I spent more than half my play time last night on the neck pick up of my '18 59. I think the 6G4 is very similar to the VL- it has that "swallowed" sound. I run it through a Tone Preserver dropping the voltage to 117V- these things predate UL so there is no comment about voltage or wattage on the back. Of primary note is the "harmonic" Vibrato- quite different from the VL or the Deluxe. With the speed and the rate at about 2/3 it is really similar to a leslie.
I need some more time with it to get some range ideas; I haven't even plugged into the Normal channel yet.
Wally or Sonar- the Presence knob does something- brightens the tone I want to say- but what is it actually doing? No where near as dramatic as a Marshall- but like the '63 Bassman I used to own- it's not that big of a deal- or is some cap out of spec?
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
I haven't been thru it yet, but my friend gets some good amps. This one came from a guys attic in Alaska- it belonged to his father- he bought it from an ad in a music magazine in the 1990's. Amazing folks traded like that back then. Him and his partner are pretty technical and they went thru it, checked the capacitor values and replaced the filter caps. it sat largely unplayed for 20+ years but they ran them up slowly with a variac annually. I have the originals caps- or the ones that replaced the original ones in a bag. The Trem is very strong and sci-fi and magical- which says the guts are in ok shape.
I have had it up to 5+ and it is an authoritive sounding amp- as are those era Fenders- barks and really cuts thru. I missed having 10's- they are great. Whoever reconed them knew his stuff- he is in Minneapolis named "Benson" and specializes in Jensens I guess.
 

agogetr

Active member
Joined
Jan 22, 2019
Messages
451
cant tell from the pic but the 60 should have the sharp front edge. the last '60' i got was a pro from a friend at a musicians swapmeet 1400 bucks and clean as a whitle (he always had great deals) i found out day before yesterday he passed from cancer. he was a good dude. life is short. you get a few good meals.. a few laughs and... seacrest out
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
In the picture with the VL you can really notice the edges are much sharper on the Super. Nothing I would notice if they weren’t side by side.
 

Jeff West

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2002
Messages
877
corpse- If yours is "JL", I'd really be interested to confirm that it conforms to the 11/60 6G4-A schematic, circuit-wise.

In the fall of 1960, like my "JI" (below) which looks just like yours, there was an "in between" brown Super circuit that had "6G4-A" on the tube chart and was 6 preamp tube circuit, but had quite different tone stack arrangement (not just different component values) and a few other circuit nuances. I've seen 6 or 7 of these, mainly from 9/60, there was one at Lark Street when I was last there a year ago which they were thinking was a "prototype". But apparently there was never an official Fender schematic for these (unlike for some other mid-late 1960 models that had a schematic depicting the same "in-between" Baxandall style tone stack, e.g., the schematic for the 6G8 Twin, dated 6/60). I'm guessing that yours is actually as depicted in the 6G4-A schematic, by December, like the couple of Jan '60 Supers I've examined.

Jeff

dhcaaXXqQtTSlnX64zftNJ8U0Y15y17MimhGJbnWkVokt-UWQY41h3hUcztAlEH84JdQ7_o=s128
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
4-String- I’d be happy to but can’t until Thursday or Friday. Headed out of town. I love how Fender has the official production line reputation and all of these variations. I posted about my VL- it had a factory- installed linear pot that was supposed to be audio taper. What a great amp.
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
Wally
I have to resist just playing that one all the time- but the VL gives it a run for it's money. 4 String I know I owe you pics- I will get to it.
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
IMG_1972_zpsemlpkwwv.jpg

IMG_1971_zpsmzwnyu87.jpg

IMG_1974_zpsmuoit3wb.jpg

IMG_1975_zpsrk9abr7i.jpg


Jeff
Well it's a good thing you didn't need a kidney or anything. The pic of the PT really vexed me as the amp is so pristine. There would have been no reason to replace it. It has the copper strip in it like some have (ground strap?)- but no marking. No idea. What would fry a PT? And why would it be replaced with such an unusual one- most of these have the all-black iron showing? My friend owned this for a long time and it was like this when he got it. Another Fender three legged dog story.
I love this amp.
 

Wally

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 27, 2003
Messages
3,535
Corpse, I see an ‘8087’ model number stamped on the inside bell cover of the PT. That much is correct. The choke looks to be correct. The OT??? Is there anything stamped on the paper? 45216?
 

Jeff West

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2002
Messages
877
Thanks for more photos, Corpse! In terms of the circuit, the easiest way to tell the 2nd version from the third version brown Super of 1960 is to look at the back of the bass pot on the Vibrato channel. The "2nd" or middle version will have small caps coming off both sides of the bass pot. The standard 6G4-A like the schematic, as in 1961-62 6G4-As, will have one side of the bass pot (the right, as you face the back of the pot) unconnected to anything. Bear in mind that both the "2nd" and "3rd" versions have "6G4-A" printed on the tube chart, and 6 preamp tubes. I'm not seeing the back of the pots in your photos, but since yours is 12/60 I strongly suspect it's the 3rd version like the 6G4-A schematic (with one terminal free on the bass pot). I looked at my notes and have reference to both 11/60 and 12/60 6G4-As like that. The "2nd" versions like mine all seem to be coded 9/60 and one 10/60, from what I've seen, so far. Maybe there are some slightly earlier ones. Both versions sound good, but the tone section definitely acts differently.

Your transformers look good, and original, to me. Super of 1960 should have an open OT like that, usually inked 45216 on the paper, nothing stamped on the top of the metal. I'm not sure what you mean by "all black iron showing", but it should not be enclosed in metal like say a bassman, etc. Mine is enameled black, like yours, (and lacquer dipped) although I think I've seen bare metal versions too, maybe on slightly later wheat grille brown Supers, still open frame.

At one point I had a tweed 5F6-A with the same 9/60 date code as my brown Super ("JI"). It deviated a little from the 5F6-A schematic, in the presence and tone controls section. The PTs in both amps looked exactly the same in all details.

Enjoy-
 

corpse

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2007
Messages
4,876
Thanks Jeff and Wally. I was nervous as I was used to seeing bare metal (galvized) OT and the PT with a Fender part number. Sonar said it was cool too so I slept (for the first time all week- LOL). The thing looks new to me- it is so clean.
That is amazing- they were making pink/blonde- at the same time as tweed. I just visualize the conversion from one to the other as "flip the switch".

And for my next trick I see a 1960 Pro...
 

Jeff West

Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2002
Messages
877
Corpse- Are those P10Rs in yours? It seems like most if not all 1960 Supers had P10Rs stock. In contrast, all the '60 5F6-As I've seen that had known original Jensens had four P10Qs, including that one with the same date code. It hardly seems fair. If you turn up, the Super can blow those small 1" paper voice coils in a heartbeat. They don't usually go open, just get very raspy and rubbing, or worse, in a one-way death dive.

The Minnesota "Benson Recone" was Jim Benson Electro Organ Svc, 4055 Cinnabar Drive, Eagan, MN 55122. I had numerous original P10Rs and P10Qs reconed by him 20+ years ago, he was great. I'm still using some of those, carefully. I talked to him on the phone many times. He told me he used to do many brands, but then decided to specialize in Chicago Jensens. He had the exact old parts and good new parts, original paint, Jensen stickers, great knowledge of the many Jensen variants, exactly how they had been put together and how they sounded. I also bought a couple of NOS vintage Jensens from him. Do your P10Rs or Qs have "W533" written on the cones in a nice flowing hand? Not sure if he's still with us or what (anyone here know?). I've tried to find him a few times over the years, but never did anymore, and never found a definitve update on his status. But, as they say, his work carries on . . .
 
Top