Need info on Historic details

JoeyV · 12-04-01, 08:16 AM

Hi,
Im the new guy so please bear with me and my dumb questions....
I took y'all advice and I am going to pass on that production model LP Custom and look for a used Historic and I have some questions I wanted to ask that are kind of general .Here are my questions.

1. Are the Historic Les Pauls made in the Custom shop or on the production line?
2. What makes a 57 RI different than a production Standard model?
3. Is the wood of better quality?
4. Is the hardware of better quality?
5. What kind of pickups do the RI's come with?
6. What finish is used on these quitars Poly or Nitro ?
7. I've heard a few people mention neck angles, what is that all about?
Thanks guys in advance
Joey

JoeyV · 12-04-01, 08:27 AM

I have not played it yet but I will check it out this week....This is from a dealer in N.H.

96 historic gold top coming in sometime next
week that weighs about 8 3/4 lbs.
(most USA standards are over 9 lbs) It's in very good shape and very loud
and resonant. 1,895.00 no tax

Ed Rafalko · 12-04-01, 08:40 AM

1. Are the Historic Les Pauls made in the Custom shop or on the production line?

Custom Shop, Nashville.

2. What makes a 57 RI different than a production Standard model?
Long neck tenon, narrow cutaway binding, non-plastic lacquer,cavity routes are different, wood is lighter, headstock shape, body shape, different hardware, diferent pickups, headstock angle, logo, headstock laminate,knobs,, and I'm sure I'm forgetting lots of other important stuff.

3. Is the wood of better quality?
Yes and no. Depends on whether or not you think light wood is higher quality than heavy wood. My thought is they're about the same.

4. Is the hardware of better quality?
Jope. It's just different, not of higher quality.

5. What kind of pickups do the RI's come with?
Classic '57s. Productions come with 496T and 498R. I think.

6. What finish is used on these quitars Poly or Nitro ?
Noitro with no vynil. Productions use nitro with vynil.

7. I've heard a few people mention neck angles, what is that all about?
In relation to how it's different from a production, teh headstock angle is 17 degrees on the RI and ( used to be) 14 on the production. They might have gone back to 17 on the production but I don't know. On a RI, the neck angle is 4 to 5 degrees depending on the individual guitar. Productio models use a different bridge, so the angle might - or might not- be different. i have't measured lately.

Other diferences: RI's use a holly wood veneer on the headstock and an older style logo. Production models use a cardboard ( yes, it's CARDBOARD, I've pulled them off before) headstock veneer with a modern logo. Neck profile is different- you'll find bigger necks on RI's.

Oh, and 1895 for a 96 goldtop is WAY too much money. Ed A has a friend who's selling his for a couple hundred less.

Spose · 12-04-01, 08:48 AM

production LP's have *weight relief*(holes drilled in the body)

as do the Class 5 and Elegant which are custom shop models and I think these have even more holes drilled than the production models.

JoeyV · 12-04-01, 09:06 AM

Are there certain years of Historic 57 gold tops to stay away from in regards to materials and craftsmanship? what is the best year for a used one?

Ed Rafalko · 12-04-01, 09:14 AM

It all depends on why you're buying. I think Id' buy Ed 's if I was going to play it. It's not quite as accurate in some ofd the details, and it's got plastic in teh nitro, but 96 was a great year for Historics.
If you want to get a new one, the 2001 for 2300 or so from davesguitar.com is really the way to go. There's no years to avoid, they all are great instruments. Some are more accurate to the originals than others, but if you aren't buying it so you can have an exact copy of a 1957 goldtop, but rather are buying it as a guitar , then you really can't go wrong with any of them.

JoeyV · 12-04-01, 09:18 AM

Im looking for a really good player instrument thats got a gorgeous tone....I been picking teles through a twin or a vibrolux and usually play with clean tones...so that is a premium for me that the guitar sounds fantastic clean and plays perfect with a set of 10's on it...How much does ed want for his?

Spose · 12-04-01, 09:20 AM

Hey Joey!

Ed A's for sale link

Spose · 12-04-01, 09:23 AM

Jeff mojojo has one in the marketplace with antiquities for sale also!

hell, drspencer1 has one for sale too!

I'd say the Les Paul Forum Marketplace would be a good place to look huh?
:dude

spin

now, the one the Mayor use to own....ahhh!
THAT was a beautiful guitar.....

Ed Rafalko · 12-04-01, 09:30 AM

I think Dave R still owns it.

JoeyV · 12-04-01, 10:02 AM

I wonder if he would lower the price....my budget is kind of low...do ya think he would take 14 or 15 for it?
Joey

Ed Rafalko · 12-04-01, 10:05 AM

GIve him a call. I don't think that price is set in stone, but he won't give it away either. He'll be fair if you'll be fair.;)

JoeyV · 12-04-01, 10:07 AM

Thank you Ed......

Ed Rafalko · 12-04-01, 10:08 AM

Don't thank me, thank the greatness that is Spose, he posted the link for you.;)

JoeyV · 12-04-01, 12:32 PM

Thanks for the this post and for this wonderful site...its a great place!!!

The Fender Forum	The Cafe Wah	LilyPix
Merchandise	Vintage Guitar Registry	LPF Homesite

12-04-01, 08:16 AM	#1
JoeyV Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 21	Need info on Historic details Hi, Im the new guy so please bear with me and my dumb questions.... I took y'all advice and I am going to pass on that production model LP Custom and look for a used Historic and I have some questions I wanted to ask that are kind of general .Here are my questions. 1. Are the Historic Les Pauls made in the Custom shop or on the production line? 2. What makes a 57 RI different than a production Standard model? 3. Is the wood of better quality? 4. Is the hardware of better quality? 5. What kind of pickups do the RI's come with? 6. What finish is used on these quitars Poly or Nitro ? 7. I've heard a few people mention neck angles, what is that all about? Thanks guys in advance Joey __________________ JoeyV jvellucci@hotmail.com

12-04-01, 08:27 AM	#2
JoeyV Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 21	Found this one from a friend I have not played it yet but I will check it out this week....This is from a dealer in N.H. 96 historic gold top coming in sometime next week that weighs about 8 3/4 lbs. (most USA standards are over 9 lbs) It's in very good shape and very loud and resonant. 1,895.00 no tax __________________ JoeyV jvellucci@hotmail.com

12-04-01, 08:40 AM	#3
Ed Rafalko Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,283	1. Are the Historic Les Pauls made in the Custom shop or on the production line? Custom Shop, Nashville. 2. What makes a 57 RI different than a production Standard model? Long neck tenon, narrow cutaway binding, non-plastic lacquer,cavity routes are different, wood is lighter, headstock shape, body shape, different hardware, diferent pickups, headstock angle, logo, headstock laminate,knobs,, and I'm sure I'm forgetting lots of other important stuff. 3. Is the wood of better quality? Yes and no. Depends on whether or not you think light wood is higher quality than heavy wood. My thought is they're about the same. 4. Is the hardware of better quality? Jope. It's just different, not of higher quality. 5. What kind of pickups do the RI's come with? Classic '57s. Productions come with 496T and 498R. I think. 6. What finish is used on these quitars Poly or Nitro ? Noitro with no vynil. Productions use nitro with vynil. 7. I've heard a few people mention neck angles, what is that all about? In relation to how it's different from a production, teh headstock angle is 17 degrees on the RI and ( used to be) 14 on the production. They might have gone back to 17 on the production but I don't know. On a RI, the neck angle is 4 to 5 degrees depending on the individual guitar. Productio models use a different bridge, so the angle might - or might not- be different. i have't measured lately. Other diferences: RI's use a holly wood veneer on the headstock and an older style logo. Production models use a cardboard ( yes, it's CARDBOARD, I've pulled them off before) headstock veneer with a modern logo. Neck profile is different- you'll find bigger necks on RI's. Oh, and 1895 for a 96 goldtop is WAY too much money. Ed A has a friend who's selling his for a couple hundred less. Last edited by Ed Rafalko : 12-04-01 at 08:41 AM.

12-04-01, 08:48 AM	#4
Spose Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: The BEST Forum on the Internet Posts: 3,995	production LP's have weight relief(holes drilled in the body) as do the Class 5 and Elegant which are custom shop models and I think these have even more holes drilled than the production models. Last edited by Spose : 12-04-01 at 08:55 AM.

12-04-01, 09:06 AM	#5
JoeyV Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 21	Are there certain years to stay away from? Are there certain years of Historic 57 gold tops to stay away from in regards to materials and craftsmanship? what is the best year for a used one? __________________ JoeyV jvellucci@hotmail.com

12-04-01, 09:14 AM	#6
Ed Rafalko Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,283	It all depends on why you're buying. I think Id' buy Ed 's if I was going to play it. It's not quite as accurate in some ofd the details, and it's got plastic in teh nitro, but 96 was a great year for Historics. If you want to get a new one, the 2001 for 2300 or so from davesguitar.com is really the way to go. There's no years to avoid, they all are great instruments. Some are more accurate to the originals than others, but if you aren't buying it so you can have an exact copy of a 1957 goldtop, but rather are buying it as a guitar , then you really can't go wrong with any of them.

12-04-01, 09:18 AM	#7
JoeyV Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 21	Im a player and never keep anything Im not playing all the time Im looking for a really good player instrument thats got a gorgeous tone....I been picking teles through a twin or a vibrolux and usually play with clean tones...so that is a premium for me that the guitar sounds fantastic clean and plays perfect with a set of 10's on it...How much does ed want for his? __________________ JoeyV jvellucci@hotmail.com

12-04-01, 09:20 AM	#8
Spose Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: The BEST Forum on the Internet Posts: 3,995	Hey Joey! Ed A's for sale link

12-04-01, 09:23 AM	#9
Spose Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: The BEST Forum on the Internet Posts: 3,995	Jeff mojojo has one in the marketplace with antiquities for sale also! hell, drspencer1 has one for sale too! I'd say the Les Paul Forum Marketplace would be a good place to look huh? :dude spin now, the one the Mayor use to own....ahhh! THAT was a beautiful guitar..... Last edited by Spose : 12-04-01 at 09:28 AM.

12-04-01, 09:30 AM	#10
Ed Rafalko Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,283	I think Dave R still owns it.

12-04-01, 10:02 AM	#11
JoeyV Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 21	I wonder if ? I wonder if he would lower the price....my budget is kind of low...do ya think he would take 14 or 15 for it? Joey __________________ JoeyV jvellucci@hotmail.com

12-04-01, 10:05 AM	#12
Ed Rafalko Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,283	GIve him a call. I don't think that price is set in stone, but he won't give it away either. He'll be fair if you'll be fair.;)

12-04-01, 10:07 AM	#13
JoeyV Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 21	Thanks Ed I appreciate the tip Thank you Ed...... __________________ JoeyV jvellucci@hotmail.com

12-04-01, 10:08 AM	#14
Ed Rafalko Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 6,283	Don't thank me, thank the greatness that is Spose, he posted the link for you.;)

12-04-01, 12:32 PM	#15
JoeyV Les Paul Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Boston Posts: 21	Thankyou Spose : ) Thanks for the this post and for this wonderful site...its a great place!!! __________________ JoeyV jvellucci@hotmail.com