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Would strings resting against the back of the bridge stop you from buying an LP?

SoCalSteve

SoCalSteve

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I guess this has to do with the neck angle of the guitar. If you found an LP that was setup the way you wanted but the strings rest against the back of the bridge, would it keep you from buying it? Is it important enough to move on and look at others or would you maybe top wrap the strings?
 
DanD

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SoCalSteve said:
I guess this has to do with the neck angle of the guitar. If you found an LP that was setup the way you wanted but the strings rest against the back of the bridge, would it keep you from buying it? Is it important enough to move on and look at others or would you maybe top wrap the strings?
Click to expand...

You could either raise the stop tail for added clearance or top wrap. If all else was well it wouldn't stop me from buying it.
 
D'Mule

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Is it your belief that a good LP must have the tailpiece screwed down all the way? I see no reason to believe that's true.

A lot of great LPs have a steeper neck angle (and more voluptuous top carve).
 
Twinfan

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Wouldn't and didn't stop me from buying an LP-type. I thought I would raise the tail but as it sounds so good now I'm leaving well enough alone!
 
C

C-4

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I prefer low neck pitch angle LP's with low bridges, but I never screw the stoptail down all the way. There is no need to do that for me, unless I am fine-tuning the string tension to taste.

I also have not seen top carved LP's with steep neck pitch angles that have a deeper top carve on a Gibson. On Edwards guitars, yes, but not on Gibsons.
 
Rare Form

Rare Form

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A good set up will take care of this. The tailpiece will be set in relation to the bridge height so that this does not happen. Depending on the neck angle the bridge may be lower and thus the tailpiece can be lower. It is worth it to get a professional set up once you buy it anyway. I once had a Custom that did this a little bit on the E and B strings and I just left it alone. Never had a problem. I have owned many Gibsons and many Les Pauls and every single one of them needed to be set up after buying, that is until my recent R0 purchase. Believe it or not, it did not need a single thing except some nail polish on a bridge saddle to stop the rattle.
 
Encycmet

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What's so bad about having the strings on the back of the bridge? I don't understand.
 
Rare Form

Rare Form

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It is not necesarrily a bad thing. It depends how much pressure they are putting on the bridge. If they are really pulling down on the bridge, it can cause the bridge to slant toward the nut making it hard to intonate the guitar. This would be more of an issue with an ABR-1 than with a Nashville bridge. Another issue is the strings can start cutting into the bridge and eventually cut themselves a groove in the bridge which could cause string breakage. The other issue (and some may arugue) but my luthier told me that having them touching the bridge does not promote the best oscillation of the strings from the bridge saddles to the nut. He has told me that the design is for the strings to have their two points of contact where vibration occurs at the bridge saddles and at the nut not also with the bridge itself. I trust his opinion since he is a master luthier and once worked for Gibson and designed guitars for Alvarez and others back in the 80's. My experience is if you find the position you like best with the tail piece and they touch the bridge just a bit, it may not be a problem, but it may not be the ideal situation for performance and tone.
 
Encycmet

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I've got a handful of TOM guitars, and I've never even thought about it. I'll have to check tonight.

Thanks for the info!
 
Rare Form

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Encycmet said:
I've got a handful of TOM guitars, and I've never even thought about it. I'll have to check tonight.

Thanks for the info!
Click to expand...

Again, in my posts I have said if it is doing it just a little bit. It should not really be a problem. For example if you could easily lift the string off the bridge with a slight pull with your fingers, they may just be resting there. However, if they are really clamped down, you may want to look into repositioning it.
 
azlavalamp

azlavalamp

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Encycmet said:
What's so bad about having the strings on the back of the bridge? I don't understand.
Click to expand...

I am also confused. Daised an Confused of course :dude: , but unclear as to what you mean about the strings "resting" on the back of the bridge.
 
Jurius

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Rare Form said:
It is not necesarrily a bad thing. It depends how much pressure they are putting on the bridge. If they are really pulling down on the bridge, it can cause the bridge to slant toward the nut making it hard to intonate the guitar. This would be more of an issue with an ABR-1 than with a Nashville bridge. Another issue is the strings can start cutting into the bridge and eventually cut themselves a groove in the bridge which could cause string breakage. The other issue (and some may arugue) but my luthier told me that having them touching the bridge does not promote the best oscillation of the strings from the bridge saddles to the nut. He has told me that the design is for the strings to have their two points of contact where vibration occurs at the bridge saddles and at the nut not also with the bridge itself. I trust his opinion since he is a master luthier and once worked for Gibson and designed guitars for Alvarez and others back in the 80's. My experience is if you find the position you like best with the tail piece and they touch the bridge just a bit, it may not be a problem, but it may not be the ideal situation for performance and tone.
Click to expand...


I would have thought this would be more of an issue with a Nashville than and ABR since the Nashville is wider.
 
DanD

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azlavalamp said:
I am also confused. Daised an Confused of course :dude: , but unclear as to what you mean about the strings "resting" on the back of the bridge.
Click to expand...

Follow the string from the stop tail to the bridge saddles. Now take a piece of paper and see if it will slide between the rear edge of the bridge (behind the saddles) and the each string. A narrow 1" strip of paper works good for this.

My eyes aren't what they used to be so sometimes when the string is close it's tough to see if the string is actually resting on the bridge or just real close. If the paper will slide between the string and rear most edge of the bridge there is clearance. If not the string is "resting" on the bridge. If this is the case I will slacken the strings and raise the tail piece ever so slightly.

The only real problems I've had with ABRs is from forward lean. I surmise it's due to the height of the bridge. I now use extra thumb wheels under the bridge if it sits high.

Personally my preference is for a neck angle that allows the ABR bridge to have the posts almost flush with the top of the bridge or ever so slightly recessed. Definitely less than an 1/8" from the top surface of the bridge. I've found that leverage from the strings at the stop tail will tend to bend the studs more easily when the bridge rides higher on them. Extra thumb wheels will help support the studs if necessary.

I had this problem on my '91 Classic Plus. A heavy pick hand and lots of palm muting exacerbated the forward lean problem.

Just my 2...:2zone
 
Rare Form

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Jurius said:
I would have thought this would be more of an issue with a Nashville than and ABR since the Nashville is wider.
Click to expand...

If you look at what I posted, the area where I state that the problem would be more with the ABR-1 is where the bridge is pulled foward. This is because the ABR-1 is thinner and its posts go directly into the wood without the surrounding support that the Nashville bridge has on its posts. The other problems of strings cutting into the bridge are more common on the Nashville. But in any event if the strings are not clamping down on the bridge and you can slide a piece of paper under them or easily pull them up it may not be a problem.
 
DanD

DanD

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Rare Form said:
If you look at what I posted, the area where I state that the problem would be more with the ABR-1 is where the bridge is pulled foward. This is because the ABR-1 is thinner and its posts go directly into the wood without the surrounding support that the Nashville bridge has on its posts. The other problems of strings cutting into the bridge are more common on the Nashville. But in any event if the strings are not clamping down on the bridge and you can slide a piece of paper under them or easily pull them up it may not be a problem.
Click to expand...

+1

I've never had the lean issues with a Nashville bridge. The posts on a Nashville are much stouter.
 
les strat

les strat

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But you'll experience the string resting on the back of the bridge on a Nashville before you will an ABR.
 
Rare Form

Rare Form

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"If they are really pulling down on the bridge, it can cause the bridge to slant toward the nut making it hard to intonate the guitar. This would be more of an issue with an ABR-1 than with a Nashville bridge."

This quote was intended to state that if the strings do pull down on the bridge, the bridge would pull foward and this forward pull would happen more on an ABR-1 than would on an Nashville Bridge. And yes, the strings touching the bridge would occur mostly on Nashville bridges because it is wider. I have seen it happen to ABR-1 bridges where the bridge is high, the tailpiece is low and the bridge is already leaning foward, then you will get strings possibly touching the bridge. At this point you would probably be breaking strings quite frequently because the break angle is too steep.
 
SoCalSteve

SoCalSteve

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Thanks for the input, guys. I wasn't inferring in my original post that it was a necessarily a bad thing, I just wanted to hear others' views on the subject.

This particular LP has a good feel to it and good sustain so I may just mess with it and see if I prefer raising the stoptail or top wrapping the strings to alleviate the tension.

I think I may get a Tonetail, that aluminum tail piece that's notched for top wrapping.
 
RiverRatt

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I kept the tailpiece screwed all the way down on my Deluxe because I liked the tone and the higher tension. Yeah, the strings hit the back of the bridge (ABR) and yeah, the posts leaned forward after awhile, but they are really easy to straighten, and also easy to replace with stronger steel posts.
 
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