R9 louder than R0

Ronsonman · May 27, 2017

I've got a 2016 R9 and a 2014 R0. I've changed the lead pickups on both guitars many times. It's like an obsession.
I am always amazed that when I play the R0 for awhile and switch to the R9, same amp settings, I always have to
turn the volume down, to match the sound level of the R8. Is it just the wood difference in the two guitars or could
the control pots cause this? By the way they are within an ounce of each other weight wise, around 8.9 lb.s

Mats A · May 27, 2017

Every guitar is in someway or another different. If you compare two Les Pauls acoustically one often sounds louder than the other. Then it could be the other way around if you plug them in.

J T · May 27, 2017

Same pots?

Same Cap values?

Ronsonman · May 28, 2017

J T said:
Same pots?

Same Cap values?

Yeah, the lead pickup pots are the same. But I did replace the Bumble Bee's in the R0 with good aftermarket fakes since
I solder burned the originals. You think thats it?

Ronsonman · May 28, 2017

Mats A said:
Every guitar is in someway or another different. If you compare two Les Pauls acoustically one often sounds louder than the other. Then it could be the other way around if you plug them in.

Yeah, even though they weight the same the R9 feels like it's heavier. The necks are not that much different, I think the R0 would
be considered a V2 neck as per Gibson specs I saw somewhere. Would like to think the R9 has better wood since it cost almost twice
as much.

J T · May 28, 2017

Ronsonman said:
Yeah, the lead pickup pots are the same. But I did replace the Bumble Bee's in the R0 with good aftermarket fakes since
I solder burned the originals. You think thats it?

Something in that R9s circuit must have a higher value in the R0. I wouldn't consider it a major concern except it might cause you to adjust something else down the line to compensate like pedal or amp levels.

duaneflowers · May 29, 2017

Ronsonman said:
Yeah, the lead pickup pots are the same. But I did replace the Bumble Bee's in the R0 with good aftermarket fakes since
I solder burned the originals. You think thats it?

Your aftermarket fakes could very well be ceramic (unless you saw one in half you won't know exactly what's inside) which could account for a bit of tonal difference. Not that the stock Bumblebees are any purer... most of those are fakes as well. If you want to compare apples with apples you need to start with at least two apples. :spabout

Since, in a sometimes subtle way, all guitars resonate differently, there really is no baseline from which to compare any two guitars. If they are exactly the same spec-wise, all else being equal, one being acoustically louder than the other is most likely the reason it is louder. No great mystery there.

1jamman · May 29, 2017

Ronsonman said:
I've got a 2016 R9 and a 2014 R0. I've changed the lead pickups on both guitars many times. It's like an obsession.
I am always amazed that when I play the R0 for awhile and switch to the R9, same amp settings, I always have to
turn the volume down, to match the sound level of the R8. Is it just the wood difference in the two guitars or could
the control pots cause this? By the way they are within an ounce of each other weight wise, around 8.9 lb.s

IMO , a few different factors contribute to the "different "volume levels .. Pots will do it , and even though stamped the same # of Ohms , only a reading with a meter will tell how close or different they are .... And IIRC the Gibson spec for stock 500K is +/- 10% ,, which could have a substantial effect on volume .

You've swapped the pup and that will/ should/might make a difference . Same magnet type in each pup ? That will also have an effect on volume
Some guitars are just louder then others , from the nature of the woods (might the finish come into play here ??? I'm not sure)...
String height is another variable that directly connects to Volume ... Pole pieces is another place to look for an answer ....

Lots to consider ...Thanks for Volume control knobs ... :laugh2: I use mine ...all the time :hee

surfreak · May 29, 2017

I hear the R11 is the loudest of the bunch.

Big Daddy B · May 30, 2017

In order to do a thorough evaluation, we are going to need some pics of the guitars in question

renderit · May 31, 2017

Big Daddy B said:
In order to do a thorough evaluation, we are going to need some pics of the guitars in question

Yes, pictures at full volume please so we may examine.

Ronsonman · May 31, 2017

2014 R0 and 2016 R9

R0 has a Jim Wagner Godwood A5 magnet 8.9 ohm
R9 has a Jim Wagner Crossroad A5 magnet 8.0 ohm

Zentar · May 31, 2017

I don't think Gibson likes making identically sounding pickups on purpose. I read a story by one boutique winder who was studying the Gibby P90 made today. He said he felt Gibson deliberately manufactured variances into every P90 because that was how they made the origonals in the old days. He said Gibson even copied the flaws. That was how close they copied them.

When Seymore Duncan got to look at Billy Gibbons Pearly Gates humbuckers in his 1959 LP Standard and said that Gibbon's guitar measured hotter winding than most other 59s.

Fuzzpop · May 31, 2017

Ronsonman said:
2014 R0 and 2016 R9

R0 has a Jim Wagner Godwood A5 magnet 8.9 ohm
R9 has a Jim Wagner Crossroad A5 magnet 8.0 ohm

Totally off topic, but how great are those Jim Wagner pickups? I love the ones I have in my R0.

Ronsonman · May 31, 2017

Fuzzpop said:
Totally off topic, but how great are those Jim Wagner pickups? I love the ones I have in my R0.

The bridge Crossroads is the best sounding pickup I've encountered. Was thinking of getting several more just as backups in case
he retires or something. Very sweet yet strong output. Good lows and highs.

Ronsonman · Jun 15, 2017

UPDATE: I verified with a level meter in Studio One that the lead pickup was almost 3 db less than the rhythm pickup on the R0 and R9.

Removed wiring from lead pot and connected directly to switch and it was OK (loader). Replaced pot and reconnected and all OK.
I remember the lead lug on the old pot could be wiggled, plus the old pot had been resoldered at least 5 times for pickup changes.

I can be dangerous with a solder gun. Not gonna monkey with it for awhile. Though that La Grange pickup caught my ear.

R9 louder than R0

Ronsonman

New member

Mats A

Member

J T

Well-known member

Ronsonman

New member

Ronsonman

New member

J T

Well-known member

duaneflowers

Well-known member

1jamman

New member

surfreak

Well-known member

Big Daddy B

Member

renderit

Well-known member

Ronsonman

New member

Zentar

New member

Fuzzpop

Member

Ronsonman

New member

Ronsonman

New member